Cruise Talk: More on Lifeboats

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Topic: More on Lifeboats

Terry
First Class Passenger
Member # 448

posted 05-29-2000 03:40 PM

I understand that the lifeboats on CARNIVAL DESTINY and TRIUMPH can be entered from within the ship before they are lowered and the muster stations are right alongside the lifeboats. This seems a much better way of doing things. Usually the lifeboats have to be lowered by one deck to enable passengers to board them.

Also having the muster stations inside the ship alongside the boats, keeps passengers from the elements.

Finally what do people thing of the New Marine Escape Systems (MES). How do you fancy sliding down a tube 60 to 80 feet high, in the middle of the North Atlantic, to a rubber dinghy.

Does anyone have any comments?

Terry

Posts: 391 | From: Brandon, Norfolk, UK | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 05-29-2000 06:04 PM

Terry, I've always got a comment, even if it's rubbish!

I would have thought that MES would be adopted on all 'Carnival' ships...just for the "fun" of it! It is obviously the step beyond the pool's water slide.

As for getting in the lifeboats first...that's a great idea, if they can be lowered safely and gently into the sea. I still have visions of the Titanic movies where some of the lifeboats fall into the sea!

[This message has been edited by Malcolm (edited 05-29-2000).]

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

starfish
First Class Passenger
Member # 986

posted 05-29-2000 08:18 PM

terry,I hope I never have to. I think that would put a serious damper on cruising.

Posts: 225 | From: Dallas,PA | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 05-29-2000 11:59 PM

Hi....as far as the chutes are concerned I've already commented on them previously. I'd just like to mention that I was involved from the start in the design and certification, testing etc, of this system. I've been down them many times, and watched hundreds of people of all different sizes, ages and shapes go down as well with NO PROBLEMS whatsoever. I have also been very involved with the ILRs and platforms used with them....peter

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

LizKiddo
First Class Passenger
Member # 1167

posted 05-30-2000 01:44 AM

it seems like this "MES" would take so much more time to fill the boats than boarding the lifeboats from on deck because you'd have to wait for one person to get all of the way down and out of the way before the next one would be able to jump. In a situation where they'd need to be used (read that "Not in a control situation"), I can't imagine people wanting to wait "calmly" in line...

Posts: 33 | From: Pasadena, CA, USA | Registered: Mar 2000 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 05-30-2000 06:30 AM

OK..a reply to that one. All the newer lifeboats and launches and eventually all,will be covered boats. Have you ever been to the shore on a launch? Probably, and you've seen the lineup to enter, find a place to sit? Well, believe me, to fill it to the number it's required to be able to carry in an emergency is one tight fit and it takes real time to squeeze people like that, which you won't be able to do in the timeframe.
In the chute system, MES by the way is a slide system, you don't even have to stand up as you can roll over the inflated side of the platform into the liferaft.
One of the great advantages over the slides is there are no parts except the platform at the bottom which need inflation - the sides of the slide are inflated before they can be used - and the time to readiness is under 3 minutes.
I realise it's difficult to visualize - wish I had a picture that would show it clearly...peter

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

Ryndam
First Class Passenger
Member # 1315

posted 05-30-2000 08:36 AM

On the Destiny, Triumph and Victory the lifeboats can be boarded from their stowed position, directly from the muster stations, which are also embarkation stations. There are two main advantages using this sistem: first the passenger doesn't have to be tranferred from lounges used as muster station to the embarkation station (which usually involves the use of stairs) and second you don't have to wait for the lifeboats to be lowered, allowing a faster evacuation. On the Destiny class the muster station are also covered so passengers are protected from weather elements. MES can be used on cargo ships, but I don't like it on cruise ships because problems will arise with old people, infants and handicapped passengers.

Posts: 260 | From: Genoa (Italy) | Registered: May 2000 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 05-30-2000 10:39 AM

1. MES is a slide system...NOT a chute. Two different things, and I too am not keen on the slides as there are some potential problems that you do not get with chutes.
Cargo vessels just don't need things like chutes, slides etc. They have small crews and most of them now are being equipped with the "free-fall" boats -they are on a ramp on the stern and when everyone is strapped in the motor is started, the lever pulled and the boat drops into the water and is away from the ship.
As you haven't seen a chute in operation I find it difficult to try and explain to you just how easy it is for the elderly, handicapped etc. to actually use it....peter

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

K&K
First Class Passenger
Member # 1040

posted 05-30-2000 11:28 AM

I would think that in an emergency (burning or sinking) that the sooner you get off of the ship or at least to sea level the better! You might be waiting very calmly loading from the comfort of a lounge when the lowering system fails or the ship lists so bad as not to be able to lower the lifeboat and then what. Sounds like the MES system certainly has been thought out and has some great advantages for poeple afflicted with most handicaps.
Kevin

Posts: 446 | From: Sandpoint,Idaho,USA | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 05-30-2000 01:40 PM

Hi...what Carnival is doing with the lifeboat embarkation from what I have heard, is a good idea. But it has been forced on them by newer regulations limiting the height that boats can be carried. Look at their previous ships with the boats up on high...the minimum they could get away with.
Another factor is the larger numbers which could not be accomodated on an outside normal deck, a problem really for all the mega-ships, besides the control factor....peter

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

Terry
First Class Passenger
Member # 448

posted 05-30-2000 04:52 PM

Peter

I have only heard of two MES installations so far; Star Cruises are fitting or have fitted a slide-like system such as you describe and P&O have already fitted a MARIN ARK system to the AURORA. Other newbuilds, including the QE2 are considering fitting the system.

The ARK, made in Belfast, Paddy will be pleased to hear, is a chute. Passengers drop down it at a slow rate because of baffles which make them folow a zig-zag course. The best feature of the ARK system is, the dingies, which hold I think about 150, are compleatly reversable so it doesn't matter which way up they inflate. Also passengers don't get their feet wet because the whole thing is totally enclosed.

For the lifeboats I think Carnival's system is a good one and should be adopted by other lines. I think mustering in public rooms like show lounges give completely the wrong message during boat drills.

After all, when it's warm inside the lounge, who wants to go out on to a cold windswept boat deck? That's what they thought on the TITANIC and look where that got them.

Posts: 391 | From: Brandon, Norfolk, UK | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

Paddy
First Class Passenger
Member # 357

posted 05-30-2000 06:24 PM

I have seen this system in use in a documentary about safety at sea which featured Stena Line's HSS catamaran fast ferry (see some of Malcolm's postings). this catamaran takes 1500 passengers and 150 cars on several routes in the Irish Sea and Norse Sea, and evacuation is done through these inflatable chutes/slides and platforms which inflate on the sea, and on these "pier's" you get into an attached lifeboat. It showed the Stena Line crew practising it and it does seem to be very quick and effective. However, these trials were carried out on a summer after noon in the sea with a fully able-bodied crew. So, I can't be sure of its practicality, but it certainly looked good.

I also remember a similar show about evacuation. A trial was carried out (in Larne harbour) with a new evacuation system on P&O European Ferries "Pride of Rathlin" (which was recentle names as europe's worst ferry). This system involved the chutes into life rafts, and again looked good. There were also people of all ages and abilities on it, but I wouldn't like to see either of these systems in the middle of the Atlantic on a freezing stormy night.

gohaze also mentioned the Cargo ship system of dropping a boat away from the ship. I saw this on discovery channel where it was being tested on oil rigs, where quick evacuation is essential after seeing the Piper Alpha disaster. Again, this looked effective, but NOT FOR THE FAINT HEARTED!!!!!

Posts: 763 | From: Belfast, Ireland | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 05-30-2000 07:24 PM

Terry & Paddy....Hurray..you've got it.
That's what I've been talking about. To back up a bit...the MES was designed by RFD, and Viking I believe has a similar one. Both are inflateable slides and have been around for a long time on ferries etc. like the high capacity Baltic ships. As far as I know none were approved for Ocean going passenger ships.
The chutes were originally produced in Japan for evacuation from high rise buildings, and later in the 70's adapted for use on passenger ships. Dunlop-Beaufort Canada in Vancouver obtained the rights to manufacture and develope the system, and British Columbia Ferries were amongst the first to realise the advantages. That sounds like the one being made in Northern Ireland and if the authorities have approved it for use on all ships then all I can say is "it's about time"
You mentioned the large inflateable platforms into which the people get which can hold a 100 and maybe up to 150. These are very very stable in the water - much better than a boat, and better to be in on a 'dark & stormy night'...peter

[This message has been edited by gohaze (edited 05-30-2000).]

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

Terry
First Class Passenger
Member # 448

posted 05-31-2000 01:44 PM

Peter

RFD's MARIN ARK has already been fitted to AURORA. When I looked over the ship recently I found that that she has two such installations. Port & Starboard. Small deckhouses the size of some more modern street toilets are fitted on the Promenade Deck. These house four rafts and the associated escape chutes.

Terry

Posts: 391 | From: Brandon, Norfolk, UK | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

joe at travelpage
Administrator
Member # 622

posted 05-31-2000 10:23 PM

Earlier in this thread someone mentioned the postion of the lifeboats on Carnival's Triumph. One of our readers who was on the Triumph last week was nice enough to send me a picure of the lifeboats taken from the ship's bridge wing.

Thanks Nathan.

Joe at TravelPage.com

p.s. anyone who wants to post a picture on this site is welcome to e-mail a copy to me. I will be happy to post it within the appropriate thread.

Posts: 29976 | From: Great Falls, Virginia | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

Guest
First Class Passenger
Member # 1157

posted 06-08-2000 11:16 PM

QE2's lifeboats are lowered to the Quarter Deck, then her large windows open and passengers embark the lifeboats through the passage way (window).

I think that's a good idea because no one is exposed to the elements.

Does anyone know why QE2's first 2 boats are red and the others aren't ?

Posts: 1888 | From: Earth | Registered: Mar 2000 | IP: Logged

nathan
First Class Passenger
Member # 720

posted 06-14-2000 09:52 PM

This is simply a guess, but does it symbolize some sort of command boats?

Posts: 534 | From: Knoxville, Tennessee | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

gohaze
First Class Passenger
Member # 586

posted 06-14-2000 10:13 PM

Hi...those are the 'rescue' or 'emergency' boats. i.e man over board. They are also the 'shepherd boats for the inflateable liferafts - used to tow them clear and keep them together....peter

Posts: 1909 | From: Vancouver.BC | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

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