Cruise Talk: Youth Activities Director arrested on the "Norway" for molesting a 12 year old!

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»	Cruise Talk » Cruise Ships » Youth Activities Director arrested on the "Norway" for molesting a 12 year old! (Page 1)

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Author

Topic: Youth Activities Director arrested on the "Norway" for molesting a 12 year old!

Mercy
First Class Passenger
Member # 322

posted 10-03-2000 11:05 AM

The FBI announced Monday that a Youth Activities Director on the Norway was arrested when the ship dissembarked. Apparently, he invited a 12 year old girl to his cabin and assaulted her.
Boy, isn't this every parents nightmare on a cruise. You leave your children with these people thinking they are safe. Good thing to tell your kids. NEVER go to a crew person's cabin! http://www.herald.com:80/content/today/digdocs/085785.htm

Posts: 697 | From: Stanwood, Wa. USA | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

topgun
First Class Passenger
Member # 928

posted 10-03-2000 12:01 PM

I could not help reading this post out of perverse curiousity.
Now I wish I had not.I could get this type of information from the National Enquirer if I really wanted to.

Posts: 759 | From: Burlington ont,canada Cruise center of North America | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged

jmperry1
First Class Passenger
Member # 1462

posted 10-03-2000 12:58 PM

I'm not sure I understand the tone of Topgun's reply. Certainly this is valuable cruise related information. Mercy's point - that parents should make sure their children do not visit crew member's cabins is excellent advice. Thanks for posting it Mercy!!

James

Posts: 71 | From: Oakland CA USA | Registered: Jul 2000 | IP: Logged

Ðraikar
First Class Passenger
Member # 1153

posted 10-03-2000 01:41 PM

I hope that Youth Activities Director on Norway goes to jail for a long time, I bet this was not his first time. In the end its the children that pay in maters like this and even on ships you still have to be careful.

Posts: 1710 | From: USA, New York | Registered: Mar 2000 | IP: Logged

Mercy
First Class Passenger
Member # 322

posted 10-03-2000 02:15 PM

topgun... I am a mother and feel that anything we can do as parents to keep our kids safe is important information. As you found, this article is NOT out of the National Enquirer. I felt very good about the quick response by the cruise line to this situation. I am dismayed by your attitude? Thanks James for the nice words.

[This message has been edited by Mercy (edited 10-03-2000).]

Posts: 697 | From: Stanwood, Wa. USA | Registered: Sep 99 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 10-03-2000 05:37 PM

A terrible report - but never the less worth reading!

Remember folks, crime on cruise ships is much less common than on the shore!

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

topgun
First Class Passenger
Member # 928

posted 10-03-2000 07:04 PM

I believe that we have a large number of fair and open minded contributors to this forum. Allow me to give the reasons for my posting; you be the judge:

My first reaction was to the fact that many reports only seem worthy of recording if they are of some form of tragedy. Any person in the mental health field may tell you that most individuals have a morbid interest in others misfortune.Note for instance how most persons slow down and rubberneck to see a serious car accident.

To me publications such as National Enquirer make millions by capitalizing on this quirk in human nature. This topic seemed to follow this trend.

As to the topic being a warning on the subject of streetproofing children at any age seems redundant. It should be abunbantly clear at any time.

Malcolm, regarding your comment 'A terrible report' I agree. The report now that I have read it states "the accused invited the girl into his cabin and molested her."

In my country nobody is guilty until proven so.In addition we have had a large number of cases of molestation thrown out of court,but many persons have been ruined for life because of prejudgement.

Draikar, possibly this reservation will also respond to your comment "I hope the youth activities director goes to jail for a long time."

Respectfully submitted, and please dont hang me, I'm off to sea next week.

[This message has been edited by topgun (edited 10-03-2000).]

Posts: 759 | From: Burlington ont,canada Cruise center of North America | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged

hooked on cruising
First Class Passenger
Member # 1221

posted 10-03-2000 10:15 PM

Thank you so much Mercy for your post, I really don't understand your comments Topgun! How can this not be news?????? It is hardly in the same catagory as slowing down to see a car crash. I am also a parent and we are taking our 16 year old daughter with us next March break on the Sensation. She will not have her older brother to look after her and I hate to feel that she will need me to watch her every move, not because I don't trust her but because the ship may not be safe. What I plan to do with this post , is let my daughter read it and then she will know that this is a very real fear and not just her mom being paranoid. Topgun I have always enjoyed your contributions to this forum page but please do not stop others from waving a red flag if it is something of interest. I quite often go by the topic and if I think it is something that would not interest me then I don't go into that topic. Why would you come into the topic just to satisfy your own curiosity and then complain about the content in that post. I am grateful to Mercy for posting it. It seems that more and more we are hearing all kinds of strange things going on on the ships.

Posts: 243 | From: London,Ontario,Canada | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

jmperry1
First Class Passenger
Member # 1462

posted 10-04-2000 01:03 PM

Well Topgun, you've partly mollified me. I'm a criminal defense attorney and my country (USA) is supposed to have a presumption of innocence, but that's really just an historic relic. Now, the fact that a person has been arrested is usually enough proff of guilt for most judges and jurors.

I still think Mercy's post was worthwhile. Whether the cruise director is guilty of a crime or not, children should not accompany adults to the adult's cabin without parental consent.

James

Posts: 71 | From: Oakland CA USA | Registered: Jul 2000 | IP: Logged

emgrace
First Class Passenger
Member # 1618

posted 10-04-2000 01:46 PM

I am also a parent who feels that this topic was worth reading. I did not read this topic to satisfy curiosity! I'm sure I can speak for all the parents who visit this forum by saying that this topic was read out of concern for our own children. If I choose to take my child on a cruise with me, I want to know that she is in safe, responsible hands. Not the hands of a pervert! I think this should serve as a warning sign to other cruise lines in taking every measure possible to make sure our children are safe. we are paying for this after all!

Posts: 34 | From: Northampton, Mass., USA | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged

K&K
First Class Passenger
Member # 1040

posted 10-04-2000 02:15 PM

Hooked on Cruising: Yes, I agree that we are hearing about problems and crime on cruise ships more and more now adays. I think it has several contributing factors. One being that the cruise lines are starting to cooperate and not hide crimes or handle them inhouse, the other is the internet and this forum. As in the past if this story did not make the National news or wire very few people outside of the ships home port would have heard of it! Kevin

Posts: 446 | From: Sandpoint,Idaho,USA | Registered: Jan 2000 | IP: Logged

M.S.Grumple
First Class Passenger
Member # 1340

posted 10-04-2000 02:44 PM

While sharing everyones concern re the alleged attack on a 12 yr.old girl- let's not leap to judgment here.
There was a case fairly recently where the life of a minister, also a person in a position of trust, was made a living hell for over 4 years.
His accuser, a 13 yr.old girl, later confessed that she had lied to cause the man trouble.
Children most definitely have to be protected from predators as I think Mercy meant to point out in her original post.
However we also have to be aware that some children are guileful and can be great dissemblers - as with people of all ages.
Our Young Offenders Act is currently undergoing an overhaul - children as young as 10 have been found guilty of murder.
These of course are exceptions to the norm -but so are child abusers.
I certainly agree with jmperry 1 that "children should not accompany adults to the adult's cabin without parental permission."
Come on all you guys out there - how would you like to be automatically judged before being proven guilty? Especially of such a dastardly crime.

On a lighter note - hookedoncruising, does your 16 yr.old daughter really listen to her older brother? Mine never did.

Posts: 280 | From: Burlington, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jun 2000 | IP: Logged

topgun
First Class Passenger
Member # 928

posted 10-04-2000 03:31 PM

"[QUOTE]Originally posted by jmperry1:
[B]Well Topgun, you've partly mollified me. I'm a criminal defense attorney and my country (USA) is supposed to have a presumption of innocence, but that's really just an historic relic. Now, the fact that a person has been arrested is usually enough proff of guilt for most judges and jurors."

I don't believe it. As a defense attorney,how do you get any business if a charge presumes guilt. Why don't you just throw all accused in jail or execute them. Maybe this is before your time, but it sounds like the McCarthy era of the 1950's.

Posts: 759 | From: Burlington ont,canada Cruise center of North America | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged

jmperry1
First Class Passenger
Member # 1462

posted 10-04-2000 07:34 PM

Topgun:

We're beginning to get off topic here, but my reply was hyperbolic. Legally there is still a presumption of innocence in the United States. However, the type of publicity you so correctly denounce has increased the public's willingness to believe the worst about people without, in my opinion, adequate proof.

If you wish to continue this discussion, we should probably do it by personal e-mail rather than through the list.

James

Posts: 71 | From: Oakland CA USA | Registered: Jul 2000 | IP: Logged

hooked on cruising
First Class Passenger
Member # 1221

posted 10-05-2000 08:00 PM

Hi M S Grumble. Believe it or not but my 15 year old daughter really does listen to her 18 year old brother. She listens to him more than us I think. When we were on the Bolero during March break they did some things together but the real joy for us was that she could stay out a little later because he was with her or they had arranged to come back to the cabin together. We were on the very bottom deck and as far to the back of the ship as you can go so it seemed like such a distance to go and there were lots of narrow areas and darkly lit hallways. Our son is at university and will not join us next year I know i will miss that little comfort zone. I still think that any crew member who invites or even allows a 12 year old into his cabin is guilty of something even if it is only unprofessionalism.

Posts: 243 | From: London,Ontario,Canada | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

toobuckets
First Class Passenger
Member # 1238

posted 10-06-2000 09:21 AM

The original posting here was obviously to make parents aware of possible problems on a cruise ship.
As a parent, I believe in the saying "know where your children are".
Unfortunately, other passengers and their kids can be as much a hazard.
We cruised earlier this year. I was truly amazed by the number of children on board and the way that they disrupted during the daytime and evening hours.
To the point of my post. I normally take a walk last thing at night to have a coffee.
After this I go foward on the highest deck to watch over the bow and just enjoy the experience. This trip I found it almost impossible but also embarassing because of the number of teenage liaisons in various stages.
I trust my kids. Personally I would never take them on a cruise with me.

Posts: 23 | From: canada | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

emgrace
First Class Passenger
Member # 1618

posted 10-06-2000 10:56 AM

I have to agree with you toobuckets. I think the whole point of vacationing with your children is to BE WITH your children. If your going to leave them alone or in someone else's hands the ENTIRE time, why bring them at all?!

[This message has been edited by emgrace (edited 10-06-2000).]

Posts: 34 | From: Northampton, Mass., USA | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged

Rex
First Class Passenger
Member # 1113

posted 10-06-2000 12:25 PM

I agree with emgrace. Parenting is a 100% job, and you cannot let anyone else take up the slack - ever. I have been on too many vacations (including my cruises) where some (not all, but some) kids were totally unsupervised, and totally obnoxious. But others were so well-behaved at times, I thought the moms had slipped Valiums into their lunch. It always falls back on the parents - always until their brood is old enough to be accountable. When I babysit my brother's kids, I never let them out of my sight, they can do something in the blink of an eye - and they aren't even my kids. I think the appalling incident on the NORWAY proves one thing - you can never be too hypervigilant when it comes to your children.

Now, can't we all be friends again?

Posts: 1413 | From: Philadelphia PA, USA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 10-06-2000 01:47 PM

Another hot topic!

Please don't stop disagreeing folks, it makes for a more interesting forum!

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

topgun
First Class Passenger
Member # 928

posted 10-06-2000 03:28 PM

Rex, for sure, lets always be friends, even though we may disagree.

James, thanks for the offer to communicate by backchannel. I'm hesitant to talk to a lawyer this way. What are the fees. The last time I talked to a divorce lawyer ten years ago, it cost me bigtime.

Toobuckets, you really nailed the topic in a very observant way. I thought the original posting on this thread to be press type sensational. Your point of view seems more objective.

Concerning kids on board,the teenage group do not normally seem to disrupt too much since they don't usually appear until the late stages of the day when the sun has gone down. I have no problem with them. I would not however take a teenager with me on a cruise. I would take the mediaeval approach of having them stay at home and leaving the key with a very, very trusted friend.

Posts: 759 | From: Burlington ont,canada Cruise center of North America | Registered: Nov 1999 | IP: Logged

mrblanche
First Class Passenger
Member # 714

posted 10-06-2000 06:47 PM

"Hooked,"

I would be very certain you have warned your 16-yr old of possible problems, but also keep an eye on her. On our recent cruise, some of the crew members gave drinks to a 16-yr old in our party. It could be they didn't realized her age (she looks older), but I wouldn't bet on it.

Posts: 308 | From: Cedar Hill, TX | Registered: Aug 99 | IP: Logged

cruznut6
First Class Passenger
Member # 543

posted 10-06-2000 07:59 PM

Let's not rush to judgement without all the facts. If he is indeed guilty, the evidence will show this. If he's actually innocent, his reputation, career and life are ruined. Think about that before deciding his fate and passing judgement.

Respectfully, Bob

Posts: 161 | From: Mount Laurel, NJ, USA | Registered: Apr 99 | IP: Logged

Ascendancy
First Class Passenger
Member # 840

posted 10-07-2000 12:41 PM

I'm for the majority. Why take your child on a cruise unless you have intentions on spending time together? Many parents like to leave their children with someone else and then they can't figure out why their child drifts away in their teen years.
Cruznut has a point. He hasn't been convicted yet. But he's probably guilty though.
I feel sorry for day care or any child care organization. They don't make enough money to handle the family problems that they shouldn't be involved in. They have no leverage when it comes to discipline and the parents claim they raise little angels.

Posts: 354 | From: Aurora, CO | Registered: Oct 1999 | IP: Logged

hooked on cruising
First Class Passenger
Member # 1221

posted 10-07-2000 04:57 PM

Toobuckets, I don't understand your statement-----I trust my kids, but I'd never take them on a cruise.-----Why ever not???

We spend time as a family all the time and my kids are almost 16 and 19. The memories we have especially since coming to Canada 13 years ago are the things that bond us together. You will never know what it is like to sit on the deck of the ship eating breakfast under the Caribbean sun with your teenage kids and chat about what is going on in their lives or what things they are looking forward to ETC ETC without the phone ringing or the doorbell going. We did not hesitate to include our kids when we planned our first cruise last year. You don't know what your missing. Getting back to the original topic I was just sharing my view as to why I thought the post was a good one and hoping maybe someone else would answer the post that had kids in the same age group and share ideas.

Posts: 243 | From: London,Ontario,Canada | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

toobuckets
First Class Passenger
Member # 1238

posted 10-07-2000 05:44 PM

hooked on cruising, You don't understand.
The answer is hormones.

Posts: 23 | From: canada | Registered: Apr 2000 | IP: Logged

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