I find Royal Caribbean to have the better shows, and food and service to be about equal (it's actually much better on Carnival). I think cabins are better designed and decorated on Royal Caribbean for the most part. Standard cabins are a bit smaller on Princess, with VERY small showers on many of the ships.

It's true that Royal Caribbean is more expensive to sail than Princess, but people seem willing to pay the prices and usually come away very satisfied.

As far as extra charges, well Princess probably takes the cake as the "nickel and dime" line. They were one of the first to start charging for things such a premium ice cream, fresh squeezed orange juice, etc. Princess tries to generate onboard revenue as much if not more so then most any other line I have sailed. There is always sometime to "buy", but this is the case on just about any line.

There are a few things I prefer on Princess. The minimal announcement policy, the 24 hour gyms, and the fresh water heated 24 hour pools. These are the best features of Princess IMO.

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Originally posted by eroller:
[QB]I prefer Royal Caribbean. QB]

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I agree with Ernie. RCCL would be my choice. I have sailed with them 11 times and was only somewhat disappointed with one cruise (Vision of the Seas, 2002). I just got of the Monarch of the Seas and it was my best cruise since the Song of Norway in 1994. Until about four years ago, Princess was superior to RCCL. Howver, they have really downgraded their services to a Carnival level, and as Ernie said, initiated the nickel and diming revolution. Unfortunately, RCCL has caught on to that trend. Effective just a couple of weeks ago, ice tea and juices are no longer included. When I think back to my great cruises on the Song of Norway and Song of America, I remember when wine was free with dinner, and all soft drink, teas, juices, and ice cream was included.

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Originally posted by vikingcrown:

Effective just a couple of weeks ago, ice tea and juices are no longer included.

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That is insane! RCI should be ashamed of themselves, and I hope passengers will express their dissatisfaction to the line.

I don't mind paying for premium name brand items such as ice cream, specialty restaurants, etc., so long as the generic substitute is still offered for free onboard. When lines start changing for industry standard free items like juice and ice tea, with no other free substitutes available, well, I have a big problem with it.

I really feel this quest to increase onboard revenue is going to kill cruise lines and the reputation of the cruise industry in the long run. People will eventually get sick and tired of having to whip out the ole cruise card for every little thing and seek other alternatives to cruising. Part of the appeal of cruising has always been it's all-inclusive nature. When that fades savvy consumers will seek vacation alternatives like all-inclusive resorts where the term "all-inclusive" has true meaning.

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Originally posted by eroller:
Part of the appeal of cruising has always been it's all-inclusive nature. When that fades savvy consumers will seek vacation alternatives like all-inclusive resorts where the term "all-inclusive" has true meaning.

Ernie

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I forgot to mention I've been reading a lot of posts lately about "sticker shock syndrome" from inaugural passengers on QM2. It seems QM2 is not only expensive to book, but expensive to sail on as well.

All these cruise lines love to tout their all-inclusive nature, but it is simply not true anymore. Unless you book a line like Silversea or Seabourn, you usually end up with a bit of sticker shock at the end of the cruise which is a major turn-off. It's so easy to forget just how much you are spending when that little cruise card comes in so handy. Cruise lines know this and make it *very* easy to spend your money.

I realize there has to be an offset to the very cheap cruise fares now being offered, but there has to be a happy medium, and one that doesn't threaten the integrity of the cruise industry.

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Originally posted by CGT:
Ha ha ha! It's the pathetic mass market wave of the future!

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Yes, and it's doesn't bode well for ships like QM2 either, which I also just read has some mass-market traits. One is the pool towel policy. You get one in your cabin, return it or be charged at the end of the cruise. Sounds like Carnival and Royal Caribbean to me. Also you are charged to use the sauna and steam room, and there is no changing facility. Even Carnival allows free use of these facilities. I can't believe Cunard sometimes. They can be rather cheesy on occasion for a "premium" line.

Princess also places pool towels in the cabin, one per person, but I don't believe you are charged if you don't return them. I was just on the CORAL PRINCESS in October but I can't remember. Too many cruises I guess. Thankfully Celebrity and HAL still offer unlimited towels by the pool.

I'll take Silversea personally. Unlimited bath "sheets" by the pool, and attendants that pass around ice cold towels and complimentary (like most all beverages) bottled water.

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Originally posted by eroller:
Princess also places pool towels in the cabin, one per person, but I don't believe you are charged if you don't return them.

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You should be, it's not your property, you shouldn't be taking it. Nothing wrong with being charged for the towel if you don't return it. It's right that you are charged.

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Originally posted by eroller:
Also you are charged to use the sauna and steam room, and there is no changing facility.

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Yes this was a design mistake by not building the steam and sauna outside of the revenue area of the Canyon Ranch Spa. Actually, I thought the gym area did have changing rooms, but just lacked the steam/sauna, but I might be mistaken.

[ 01-31-2004: Message edited by: CGT ]

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Originally posted by CGT:

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Originally posted by eroller:
Princess also places pool towels in the cabin, one per person, but I don't believe you are charged if you don't return them.
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You should be, it's not your property, you shouldn't be taking it. Nothing wrong with being charged for the towel if you don't return it. It's right that you are charged.

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Oh I agree, but I was not talking about stealing towels. I've never taken a ship towel home with me nor do I have any desire to.

I meant returning them to a used towel bin around the pool area as opposed to having to return them to your cabin.

Carnival, Cunard, and Royal Caribbean (maybe NCL too) keep track of every pool towel. You are given one towel per person, you must guard it while you are around the pool so no other passenger steals it, then it must be returned to the cabin and be accounted for by the cabin steward. If you don't return the towel, a charged is placed on your shipboard account.

Princess gives you pool towels in your cabin, but I believe you can just return them to a big bin around the pool and not worry about them being stolen by another passenger or having to return them to your cabin.

As I stated earlier, Celebrity and HAL have the best policy (and the same that *all* cruise lines used to have). Unlimited towels by the pool that can be used by the pool, and also returned by the pool area. No lugging wet used towels back to the cabin after a day in the sun. A much preferred policy.

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Originally posted by eroller:

Princess gives you pool towels in your cabin, but I believe you can just return them to a big bin around the pool and not worry about them being stolen by another passenger or having to return them to your cabin.

Ernie

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Originally posted by vikingcrown:
Effective just a couple of weeks ago, ice tea and juices are no longer included.

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I don't have the time or energy to keep up with some of the other boards any more, but I recall reading something about this on another site and from my quick perusal I thought that there was a misunderstanding in the wording of soda card sales info. Something along the lines of 'soda cards include all non-alcoholic beverages, including soft drinks, iced tea, and juices.' RCI simply added iced tea and juices (which are complimentary for all guests) to make it seem like a better value.

Is that true or did RCI truly start charging for iced tea and juices?

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:
Surely pool towels only cost a cruise line a couple of dollars each, judging by the numbers they must buy in bulk? They could give every passenger one and add the cost to the fare without anybody noticing!

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Malcolm,
There was never a problem with pool towels being stolen. For the most part they were generic without any logo. They were medium in quality and there would be no reason to take one. It would be just as easy to steal a towel from a cabin steward's cart or out of your bathroom. They were inexpensive to replace as well, just as you mentioned.

The main reason cruise lines implemented this new pool towel policy is to save money, and even generate a little revenue. They no longer need the staff to pick up used towels and keep replenishing them by the pool. Also, people used to take more then one towel (like me) for use to lie on and to dry off after swimming. Of course this created a lot more laundry for the ship and expense. There is also the argument that this "one towel per person" policy alleviates chair saving. It's not true, and the same amount of chair saving still occurs. Of course the cruise line also makes a little extra money by charging for towels not returned, and by people actually wanting to buy them as a souvenir since they have the line's logo on them. I really resent having to "guard" my towel since I'll be charged if it is stolen by another passenger who probably had theirs stolen.

A little card comes with the towels in the cabin and states they are provided for "your convenience". It's BS. Just another revenue generating feature of today's mass-market lines.

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Originally posted by CGT:

No, on Princess you bring it back to your cabin and the steward or stewardess replaces it with a new one.

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I guess I gave Princess more credit then was due. They are no better then Carnival and Royal Caribbean in this regard.

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Originally posted by eroller:

I guess I gave Princess more credit then was due. They are no better then Carnival and Royal Caribbean in this regard.

Ernie

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Well in this regard I never said they were! By the way, I just remembered. My brother just returned from the MONARCH OF THE SEAS and juices and iced tea were included with the soda card. Unfortunately, the bartenders were still charging people, and arguing with passengers who insisted that juices and iced tea were included. My brother happened to have, however, a print out from the internet from the RCL website that stated that juices and iced tea were included with the soda card. He went to the pursers office and they told him yes, indeed, it is a new policy to have those items included with the soda card. He went back to the bar and the bar tender manager continued to argue with him that it was not. So my brother went back to the Pursers desk (or "guest relations" ) and was told again that yes it was included, and even was shown a company email that was sent out stating the new policy had been in effect for some time now, and was told that the bar tender manager should have known about it, that he was told. So the purser on duty called the bartender manager on the phone and effectively scolded him and corrected him, and all the charges for juice and iced tea were removed from his account. I don't know however if you still get the juice and iced tea without the card. I think not.

[ 01-31-2004: Message edited by: CGT ]

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Originally posted by CGT:

Well in this regard I never said they were!

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Originally posted by vikingcrown:
Effective just a couple of weeks ago, ice tea and juices are no longer included.

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[ 01-31-2004: Message edited by: Commodore ]

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Originally posted by Commodore:
Why just Royal Caribbean and Princess, like I said there are better alternatives to both, such as NCL. Freestyle Dining isn't bad at all, in fact it's fairly pleasent.

[ 01-31-2004: Message edited by: Commodore ]

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