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Originally posted by Thad:
There are rumors eminating out of Spain that Carnival is seriously looking into purchasing Pullmantur. This seems a more than a little too anti-competitive to me, but we will have to stay tuned to developments.

Thad

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Pullmantur gives a very good cruise-experience, good relation price/quality - it is not stuffy but also not ridiculous, good stylish tourist class, just what we need. Relaxing, not intrusive, and with a love for ships.

It is succesful in its own right. They have an eye for quality : all their ships are secondhand, but originally first class ships.
If Carnival would dump its older tonnage there, this quality series would start.

I still cannot understand why and how EU and US competion regulators could approve of the "merger" of Carnival and Princess, and I hope they will be wiser now.

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:
It would be nice to see someone else (RCI and NCL) getting a bigger slice of the pie!

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What's the problem as long as they let Pullmantur keep their own identity, just like the other 'Carnival' owned companies ? ?

The only thing I hope that the atmosphere on Pullmantur ships will not be 'Americanized'.

It is likely that Carnival has decided not to expand the Carnival Cruises product to different niches as much as to purchase successful products with an already determined market niche. Hense to get the traditional market, buy Holland America, the upscale market, buy Seabourn, classic upscale - buy Cunard, etc, etc. The aquisition of Costa was to tap into the European / Italian clientel more recently. So it would make sense that Carnival has been watching Pulmantur's success in the latin market niche. To aquire that market segment, why not buy it, already established? Apparently the latin market has matured since Carnival's experiment with Fiesta. Further, it offers a venue to transfer older fleet tonnage and solidify Pulmantur's product line. I would weep if that displaced Oceanic. But we all know Carnival is apprehensive of selling existing tonnage to competitors.

No whether this is good or bad...the jury is out. With HAL as example, I am grateful the Carnival aquisition preserved the brand, invested in growth and further defined the brand's identity. However, I cannot deny seeing a 'Carnivalization' to some degree in the HAL product.

It is is this strategy that makes Carnival a success. And RCI is following the same pattern. First aquiring Celebrity as it's upscale brand. Then branding niche products where Viking Serenade and Horizon have been example players. Where I see the major difference is that RCI's mass market brand is more palatable than Carnival product and it pays to expand that brand with larger ships within that brand.

Carnival is a master of marketing. Rather than chucking ship out there to see who buys berths, they instead examine a market niche, study it's capacity and then offer up products to satisfy the demand. I think Carnival is clever to let niche competitors battle out the turf, and once it is established, sweep it and buy it. I cannot say I like it, but it is working.

[ 02-02-2006: Message edited by: TampaMike ]

IF Carnival should somehow acquire Pullmantur (and I have yet to see any official posturing on this; so far it's only a rumor that has sprouted legs and is running all over these boards!), it would be a brilliant marketing move. Carnival could position their old ships like HOLIDAY, CELEBRATION, FANTASY-Class, plus older tonnage from their other brands.

Some people think this would duplicate Costa, but Costa is mainly for the Italian markets and also does well in Brasil. If Pullmantur were devoted to the Spanish-speaking markets, then not only in Spain but many Caribbean and South American markets could be a gold mine for Carnival with such a product.

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Originally posted by Willem H. van der Leek:

The only thing I hope that the atmosphere on Pullmantur ships will not be 'Americanized'.

Willem van der Leek

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Originally posted by cruisemole:
I bet that the Spanish and "Latin" tastes in cruises are at least as different as Americans and Brits if not more.

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it's no secret - and there nothing wrong about it - that North American cruise passengers have different expectations and demands than European passengers (and even within Europe there can be big differences). Pullmantur is a product aimed at Spanish passengers, so in Willem's opinion (and mine by the way, as well) it would be not particularly desirable if the product was changed to a product as it is usually offered to North American passengers.

Best,

I am seriously considering the Oceanic. My high school level Spanish is good enough for me to get around and take a refresher class if necessary.

Other than late dinner and much cigarette smoking, how would you differentiate Spanish cruising vs. English cruising vs. hi end American cruising eg Oceania-HAL_Celebrity?

Thanks in advance

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Originally posted by r.fiebig:
lasuvidaboy,

it's no secret - and there nothing wrong about it - that North American cruise passengers have different expectations and demands than European passengers (and even within Europe there can be big differences). Pullmantur is a product aimed at Spanish passengers,................. it would be not particularly desirable if the product was changed to a product as it is usually offered to North American passengers.

Best,

Raoul

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Ah, the Oceanic.....es un barco muy maravillosa y muy bonita, si?

At any rate, can't Carnivore just leave well enough alone? The greed just never ends.

[ 02-02-2006: Message edited by: BigUFan ]

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Originally posted by Maasdam:
If happen another reason to order more Vista's this time fore Pullmatur .

Greetings Ben.

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Malcolm wrote:
It would be nice to see someone else (RCI and NCL) getting a bigger slice of the pie!

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I agree with Maasdam, MSC would make a better proposition. It would be good to keep everything within European hands. Wonder if MSC has any thoughts on this?

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