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[ 05-21-2009: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

Well done NCL.

Cunard takes the mantle for high culture entertainment. NCL in the 'Las Vegas' style shows.

Premier Cruises entertainment was pretty bad.

In the old days entertainers would polish up their acts in the Borscht Belt, summer stock, and the better night clubs such as the Village Gate and the Whiskey a Go Go.

Unfortunately the business model has passed on.
Cruise ships are the venue for many entertainers on the way from community theater to the West End.

Let’s be honest, NCL can be rather inconsistent. ‘Freestyle Dining’ is an impressive innovation and most cruise lines have already adopted some aspects of it. However they have struggled to operate it efficiently and with quality, at times. I was onboard ‘Norwegian Jade’ last summer and I found that you had to pay a surcharge in the alternative dining rooms to get a good meal. I found the ‘free’ ones to generally serve sub-standard food. Some people also clearly do not warm to the ‘Freestyle’ system and it’s potential for creating long lines at peak times. Are NCL capable of managing such a large ship efficiently?

Epic will be a high density ship. The last that we want to see is early negative passenger reviews: “The lines for the Manhattan dining room were ridiculous”, “I never got to see the shows I wanted as they were always full”, “There were always people everywhere”, “Embarkation and disembarkation, even for excursions, was a nightmare”.

Malcolm, you are correct that NCL needs to get it's sh-- together regarding the software or the ship will be a flop no matter how impressive it is.

It will be interesting to see how they schedule evening entertainment. For instance the BMG certainly can't be performing every night, but the theater will hold less than 1000. It will actually be quite small for a ship carrying 5000 passengers! So if 800 passengers are watching BMG one night, what are the other 4200 doing? That is a lot of people to keep entertained. EPIC doesn't appear to have a lot of indoor bars/lounges. It's all restaurants and retail so what do people do after they eat? NCL is counting on some large outdoor spaces at night, but if it rains then where does everyone go?

Agree that they are relying upon the Spice H20 and Posh outdoor spaces for evening entertainment, but then again Oasis of the Seas does the same with its outdoor theater.

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Originally posted by Dutch:
The theater holds nearly 700 with two BMG shows, 4 nights during the cruise. Everyone can see BMG if they wish.

Agree that they are relying upon the Spice H20 and Posh outdoor spaces for evening entertainment, but then again Oasis of the Seas does the same with its outdoor theater.

I think the days of a large secondary showlounge on ships are over.

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Well, there are some substantial advantages with OASIS. Don't get me wrong, I'm very intrigued by EPIC and will sail on her, but I can't help notice some possible issues.

On OASIS, the theater will be about twice the size of that on EPIC. In addition, besides the main theater and the Aqua Theater, there is the very large Studio B ice rink area, and a three level huge indoor nightclub, plus the glass covered solarium up front which will also become a club at night. I believe the solarium nightclub will stay dry even when it is raining. Of course then there is the huge Royal Promenade, all enclosed with Boleros, Schooner piano bar, pub, and other lounges and still yet the adults entertainment area with several little clubs (comedy, jazz, etc). Of course both EPIC and OASIS will have large casinos.

I'm just concerned on EPIC there are so many restaurants and they take up so much interior space, that what happens at 10pm when they close? I think as long as it's a beautiful Caribbean night there is no problem.

By the way, did anyone who watched the latest webcast found it "cheesy?"

[ 05-22-2009: Message edited by: Waynaro ]

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Originally posted by Waynaro:

By the way, did anyone who watched the latest webcast found it "cheesy?"

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Originally posted by Christophe D:
Remember that at the begining, Norwegian Epic don't have theater. So, 700 seats is better than 0.

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:

I think she probably did. Veitch said something like: "She would not have a 'main' theatre or any conventional cabins etc." It was mainly "hype" rather than 'fact'.

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Yes, I recall reading no "traditional buffet" either, but she will have that too! Of course it will offer NCL's "action stations" but this is pretty much what all lines are doing. At the end of the day it's still a self service buffet!

RCI's Voyager Class and Freedom Class certainly are not invincible to space problems. Just cruise in the Caribbean with a couple days of rain and you get tired rather quick fighting the crowds in indoor facilities such as the RP.

It will be interesting what happens on Oasis when it rains and the Aqua Theater, Boardwalk and Central Park are unusable and 5400 people stream into indoor venues?

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Originally posted by FL_Cruiser64:

At this point every slam against the Epic can be used against Oasis including extra charges (or does anybody think that all the extra restaurants are free?). I personally probably sail Epic before Oasis since that size ship is closer in size what I consider acceptable for a cruise ship. Plus, the Epic begins to grow on me as well.

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I don't agree. OASIS will have far more interior space and things to do if it rains. See my previous post. The deck plans speak for themselves.

EPIC may be more your size, but it will have a lot more people stuffed into it compared to OASIS. I don't think it really matters if the ship is smaller if it feels more crowded. Sort of defeats the purpose.

It remains to be seen how both OASIS and EPIC manage the crowds. I'll be sailing on both and I'll be sure to post a comparative review. My guess is that OASIS will win out in this regard. Simply put RCI are masters of ship design, and they also have organization down to a science. I can't say the same about NCL. RCI is also going to great lengths and expense to support the infrastructure needed for OASIS. New terminal in Ft. Lauderdale, a new pier in Labadee, and absolutely no tendering in any ports. The ship will also dock starboard side facing the pier to support multiple gangways, and large interior foyers (even escalators) built into that side of the ship.

It also remains to be seen how NCL's split bathroom concept is received. Some travelers will not like it. I don't like the fact that the higher categories have queen bed only. The bed can't be split into twin because it is round. This means my brother (or a friend) can't (or won't) travel in those categories because I want my own bed.

All this said, EPIC looks interesting and I'm looking forward to sailing on her.

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Originally posted by eroller:
EPIC may be more your size, but it will have a lot more people stuffed into it compared to OASIS.

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:

Yes, if my math is correct, Epic will have a space-ratio of 30 and Oasis of 42, based on single occupancy.

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Originally posted by Waynaro:
Yikes! That sounds pretty bad. I know the space-ratio is based on occupancy and tonnage. Now, I wonder what each ship's respective interior volume is?

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Wayne,
I believe the gross tonnage is a measurement of interior volume.

OASIS OF THE SEAS will be 220,000 gt and carry 5400 passengers.

NORWEGIAN EPIC will be 153,000 gt and carry 4200 passengers.

Very close in tonnage to EPIC is FREEDOM OF THE SEAS.

FREEDOM OF THE SEAS is 154,000 gt and carries 3600 passengers and is also wider and longer than EPIC.

This is what I mean when I say EPIC is going to be high density.

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:

Yes, if my math is correct, Epic will have a space-ratio of 30 and Oasis of 42, based on single occupancy.

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One thing to consider: The space ratio is volume and Boardwalk, Central Park and Aqua Theater area are included in that space ration. Take those away on a rainy day and the space ratio suddenly become 20 (exaggerated).

Anybody who has been on a Freedom Class or Voyager Class with a couple rainy days knows that. No doubt on a sunny day it will be easy to navigate. The difference with Epic though is that the 30 is the 30 even on rainy days. I think the only public space which would go into that calculation with an opening to the top is the Court Yard area.

In regard to the new terminal: I drove by there and it does not look impressive. The plan is to simultaneously embark and disembark. That would be the only way to go but it certainly will be messy with people coming off and going on.

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Originally posted by FL_Cruiser64:

One thing to consider: The space ratio is volume and Boardwalk, Central Park and Aqua Theater area are included in that space ration. Take those away on a rainy day and the space ratio suddenly become 20 (exaggerated).

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Actually since a ships size is measured in GRT and GRT is the measure of internal volume which means the the Boardwalk, Aqua Theater and Central Park areas would not be included in Oasis' GRT measurement as they are out door areas.

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Originally posted by Cunard Fan:
...which means the the Boardwalk, Aqua Theatre and Central Park areas would not be included in Oasis' GRT measurement as they are out door areas.

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Correct. There are other factors to consider, like internal layout/passenger flow which we can guess at, but will need to be experienced first hand.

An interesting comparison is that Epic will be approximately the same size as the QM2 but will carry over 1600 more passengers! That's the difference between 'premium' and 'mass market'. In some cases Epic's fares are not dissimilar to the QM2, due to the inflated 'maiden' season effect.

Oasis will be approximately 73,000 tons bigger than QM2/Epic in order to accommodate around 1400 more passengers.