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» Cruise Talk   » Cruise Ships   » Star Princess Fire 4 years ago today (Page 1)

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Author Topic: Star Princess Fire 4 years ago today
dmwnc1
Cruise Director
Member # 3785

posted 03-23-2010 09:52 AM      Profile for dmwnc1   Email dmwnc1   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfiFtheA0BU

There are some superb pictures in this pdf file of the fire damage, check out pages 18-23 of the document:

Fire Report and Pictures

From Wikipedia:

On 23 March 2006, at about 3 am, a fire broke out in the passenger compartments, amidships, on the port side of the ship. Shortly after, the captain sounded the General Emergency Signal—seven short blasts followed by one long blast on the ship's whistle, which woke passengers up all over the ship. Passengers went to muster stations and evacuees were combined into groups, then stationed in cramped rooms for about seven hours. Some passengers who needed regular medication required crew members to go into their suites and retrieve their medication.

Passengers evacuated their cabins into public areas through smoky hallways, grabbing their life jackets on the way. The evacuation was reportedly orderly, in contrast to deadlier fires such as those on the Morro Castle and Yarmouth Castle. Lifeboats were lowered, but proved to be unnecessary, as the fire was contained and doused, and the ship headed into Montego Bay under her own power.

The fire was probably caused by a cigarette left burning on a balcony, which had become hot enough to melt the balcony divides made from plastic polycarbonate, a material that had been approved by international cruise line safety rules. The fire caused scorching damage in up to 150 cabins, and smoke damage in at least 100 more on passenger decks 9 to 12 (Dolphin, Caribe, Baja and Aloha decks). A passenger, Richard Liffidge, 72, of Georgia, died from "asphyxia secondary to inhalation of smoke and irrespirable gases" and eleven other passengers suffered significant smoke inhalation.

While a smouldering discarded cigarette probably did cause the flames, the following items were also at fault for allowing the fire to spread as quickly as it did:

The balconies’ polycarbonate partitions, polyurethane deck tiles, and the plastic furniture were highly combustible and produced large quantities of very thick black smoke when burned.

The glass in the doors between the staterooms and balconies was neither fire retardant, to meet with the requirements of an ‘A’ class division, nor self-closing.

The balconies crossed main zone fire boundaries, both horizontally and vertically, and were without structural or thermal barriers at the zone or deck boundaries.

No fire detection or fire suppression systems were fitted on the balconies.

Passengers were evacuated to hotels in Jamaica and subsequently were flown home. The ship was en route from Grand Cayman to Montego Bay, Jamaica, after departing Fort Lauderdale, Florida on 19 March 2006. With 79 cabins destroyed and a further 204 damaged, the ship was moved to the Bahamas where she was prepared for a transatlantic crossing to Bremerhaven, Germany for repairs. Her remaining Caribbean cruises and a transatlantic cruise were cancelled, with the anticipation that she would begin her summer season in the Baltic mid-May.

The ship was repaired at the Lloyd Werft in Bremerhaven, set sail again on the 13 May 2006 and resumed its regular service on the 15 May from Copenhagen. Passengers reported that the only noticeable differences were a strong smell of new carpeting, the addition of sprinklers to all balconies and the replacement of plastic furniture with non-combustible alternatives

[ 03-23-2010: Message edited by: dmwnc1 ]


Posts: 5650 | From: Clarksburg WV | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
Grant
First Class Passenger
Member # 1000

posted 03-23-2010 03:02 PM      Profile for Grant   Email Grant   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Read today while sailing on Coral Princess. Makes you think; a few goose bumbs too!!
Posts: 834 | From: Victoria, BC, Canada | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
DEIx15x8
First Class Passenger
Member # 14958

posted 03-23-2010 03:08 PM      Profile for DEIx15x8   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It's been 4 years but it still seems like the main problem has not been solved here. People are still allowed to smoke on their balconies and people still leave stuff out their even though it's not allowed. It seems like this is setting up for more disasters. But what about the other issues such as the lack of smoke sensors and fire suppressors on the balconies. Have those issues been taken care of? Anyone know what kind of fire preventive steps have been taken for the balconies on the newest ships with the Celebrity Equinox, Oasis of the Seas, Carnival Dream, and NCL Epic?
Posts: 521 | From: Kutztown, PA | Registered: Apr 2008  |  IP: Logged
Magic Pipe
First Class Passenger
Member # 6994

posted 03-23-2010 06:20 PM      Profile for Magic Pipe     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
All new ships are fitted with sprinklers on balconies and non-combustible partitions. Many existing ships have been retrofitted with these. Some ships even have extended main fire zone bulkheads onto the balconies to help prevent the transmission of fire from one vertical zone to the next.
Posts: 213 | From: NYC | Registered: Jul 2006  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 03-23-2010 07:31 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Here is another case where smoking causes danger and with these modifications probably increases the cost of cruising.
Frosty 4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Maasdam
First Class Passenger
Member # 3858

posted 03-23-2010 09:21 PM      Profile for Maasdam   Author's Homepage   Email Maasdam   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I shot this video in July 9 2006 MV GOLDEN PRINCESS was in Rotterdam and they where installing the sprinkler system on here balcony's.

Greetings Ben.


Posts: 4695 | From: Rotterdam home of the tss. Rotterdam. | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Sutho
First Class Passenger
Member # 6234

posted 03-24-2010 12:49 AM      Profile for Sutho   Email Sutho   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Its definately smoking that caused it. There is no doubt about it as something burning had to set it ablaze.

The problem could still happen today and no amount of modifications can change that.

The balcony cabins on the Grand class are designed in such a way that they are open to the elements and wind. As oxygen is a strong fuel for fire all you need is the right breeze passing all these open balconies to ignite the flames and spread the fire. As the Grand class has more open and exposed balcony cabins it is very easy for fire to spread if the wind is right. Just about every balcony on that ship is a wind tunnel that can fuel a fire.

As for enclosed balcony cabins - they are isolated and more sheltered meaning that a smoke detector will pick up smoke quicker and sprinklers able to put out a single fire before it spreads to other balconies.

The only real solution to fire prevention lies not with sprinkers and smoke alarms - but banning smoking in that area all together.


Posts: 1055 | From: Newcastle, Australia | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
mike sa
First Class Passenger
Member # 5957

posted 03-24-2010 11:21 AM      Profile for mike sa   Author's Homepage   Email mike sa   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sutho

The official (and expert) report clearly stated that it was "probably" started by a cigarette - you are obviously better qualified than the experts who actually did the investigation and actually saw the evidence first hand etc - none of which you did.

Of course the only sure fire way of stopping any recurrance (using your logic) is to ban passengers from using cruise ships all together !

Smoking is only one source of heat, I don't believe there is absolute evidence that a cigarette has ever caused a ship to sink etc. - the addition of sprinklers, combined with infraread heat detecting cameras scanning the area is in the EXPERTS opinion more than adequate.


Posts: 2272 | From: Durban, South Africa | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
Tom Burke
First Class Passenger
Member # 5238

posted 03-24-2010 12:20 PM      Profile for Tom Burke   Author's Homepage   Email Tom Burke   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I read the MAIB report on the Star Princess fire with great interest. Having now cruised on Ventura, it came home to me just how considerable that fire was.

Turning the issue around, it's interesting how few fires there are on modern ships, given the number that do have open balconies.


Posts: 1469 | From: Sheffield, UK | Registered: Dec 2004  |  IP: Logged
Sutho
First Class Passenger
Member # 6234

posted 03-24-2010 06:53 PM      Profile for Sutho   Email Sutho   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by mike sa:
Sutho

The official (and expert) report clearly stated that it was "probably" started by a cigarette - you are obviously better qualified than the experts who actually did the investigation and actually saw the evidence first hand etc - none of which you did.

Of course the only sure fire way of stopping any recurrance (using your logic) is to ban passengers from using cruise ships all together ! -

(This is a foolish and provocative thing to say and only starts arguements. I would suggest sticking to the subject and not inferring I have stated things I have not!)

Smoking is only one source of heat, I don't believe there is absolute evidence that a cigarette has ever caused a ship to sink etc. - the addition of sprinklers, combined with infraread heat detecting cameras scanning the area is in the EXPERTS opinion more than adequate.


Given that I have been fully trained in Naval fire fighting and Nuclear Biological and Chemical Defence (NBCD), gives me the knowledge of the subject and the authority to know how a fire may spread and what the dangers are.

Interestingly enough if we can find the original thread four years ago about the Star Princess fire you will find my comments there about its nature and the way it spread and how it stopped was very similar to the official findings after the investigation was complete.

[ 03-24-2010: Message edited by: Sutho ]


Posts: 1055 | From: Newcastle, Australia | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Sutho
First Class Passenger
Member # 6234

posted 03-24-2010 07:23 PM      Profile for Sutho   Email Sutho   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by mike sa:
Sutho


Of course the only sure fire way of stopping any recurrance (using your logic) is to ban passengers from using cruise ships all together !
.


Here is a perfect example of this member "creating" statements that were NEVER made by other members. It is a further example of the low levels this member will go to in order to stir up trouble, disrupt topics and generate arguments and then back up.

Read it carefully. From now on I will not be arguing with his lies, I will simply publish them for all to see.


Posts: 1055 | From: Newcastle, Australia | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
mike sa
First Class Passenger
Member # 5957

posted 03-25-2010 01:10 AM      Profile for mike sa   Author's Homepage   Email mike sa   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Blah, blah, blurrrrrrrrrrrr................

I assume you will be applying for Micky Arison's job in short order. Or is World President more in line with your expertise.


Posts: 2272 | From: Durban, South Africa | Registered: Sep 2005  |  IP: Logged
Sutho
First Class Passenger
Member # 6234

posted 03-25-2010 03:39 AM      Profile for Sutho   Email Sutho   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by mike sa:
Blah, blah, blurrrrrrrrrrrr................

I assume you will be applying for Micky Arison's job in short order. Or is World President more in line with your expertise.


I have a new method of dealing with your childish and subtle ways of attempting to start an argument and that is publishing your insults.

I will make a deal with you. If you can find in this thread where I stated that having no passengers is the best way to prevent fires then I will leave this forum for good.

If not concede that you were trying to stir up trouble or leave.

For too long I have fallen into your trap when you misrepresent a quote, invent quotes people have said or stor up trouble and the threads ended up in mass arguments and topics locked. Well I am not falling into your trap anymore.

Now everyone can see above your quoted childish remarks that start arguments.


Posts: 1055 | From: Newcastle, Australia | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
dmwnc1
Cruise Director
Member # 3785

posted 03-25-2010 09:09 AM      Profile for dmwnc1   Email dmwnc1   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Other notable fires that have happened in the last several decades that I can remember are:

-Angelia Lauro while dock in St. Thomas (March 30, 1979
-Prinsendam in the Gulf of Alaska (Oct. 4, 1980)
-Achille Lauro off of Somolia (Nov. 30, 1994)

All three were total losses and sunk at sea

Others:
-(Diamond) turned Sapphire Princess while under construction at the shipyard in Japan (Oct. 1, 2002)
-Westerdam while under construction in Italy (Oct. 17, 2003)

Angelina Lauro

Prinsendam

Achille Lauro

Diamond/Sapphire Princess

Westerdam

[ 03-26-2010: Message edited by: dmwnc1 ]


Posts: 5650 | From: Clarksburg WV | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 03-25-2010 09:38 AM      Profile for PamM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Illiria, Sun Vista - both TCLs in 1999. Carnival Ectascy, The Calypso.. many more

2 I can think of from last year are Costa Romantica & Royal Princess. These of course were contained fairly quickly. One can only guess as to what the consequences could have been if all the new rules and regulations we all moan about had not been in place.

Small fires happen a lot more often than we hear about, even on QM2 we had one, and on Norwegian Dream [both electrical]. Quickly dealt with; end of story, except for the smell in the latter case. Things could have been so different 30 years ago.

Pam


Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
Maasdam
First Class Passenger
Member # 3858

posted 03-25-2010 10:13 AM      Profile for Maasdam   Author's Homepage   Email Maasdam   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The Prinsendam suffers another fire well under construction 1973. It almost ruined here.
10 years later in 1983 Nieuw Amsterdam suffers a fire in here switch board well under construction in France.

Greetings Ben.


Posts: 4695 | From: Rotterdam home of the tss. Rotterdam. | Registered: May 2003  |  IP: Logged
Fairsky
First Class Passenger
Member # 781

posted 03-25-2010 12:03 PM      Profile for Fairsky   Email Fairsky   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Let's not forget the Carnival Ecstasy's fire off the coast of Miami Feb 18, 1999:


Posts: 1685 | From: Chicago, Illinois | Registered: Jul 99  |  IP: Logged
Thad
First Class Passenger
Member # 1224

posted 03-25-2010 02:00 PM      Profile for Thad   Email Thad   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
There was also the Sun Vista fire...


Posts: 1967 | From: Boston, MA | Registered: Apr 2000  |  IP: Logged
dmwnc1
Cruise Director
Member # 3785

posted 03-25-2010 02:07 PM      Profile for dmwnc1   Email dmwnc1   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by PamM:
Illiria, Sun Vista - both TCLs in 1999. Carnival Ectascy, The Calypso.. many more Pam

Had not heard of the ILLIRIA. Impressive blaze.


Posts: 5650 | From: Clarksburg WV | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
JohnHJ
First Class Passenger
Member # 30846

posted 03-25-2010 02:10 PM      Profile for JohnHJ   Author's Homepage   Email JohnHJ   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
If memory serves correctly, the Angelina Lauro did not sink immediately after her fire in March of 79'. She sat in St. Thomas for several months before she was sold for scrap. In the summer of 79' she had been towed from St. Thomas and had successfully cleared the Panama Canal when some of her warped plates from the fire finally buckled and she started to take on water slowly. I believe she finally sank after foundering for a few days in September of 1979. I had the privilege of spending an afternoon on her in Port Everglades around 76' or so prior to her sale to Costa. She was a lovely ship with beautiful lines.
Posts: 60 | From: Tallahassee, FL | Registered: Jan 2010  |  IP: Logged
dmwnc1
Cruise Director
Member # 3785

posted 03-25-2010 03:27 PM      Profile for dmwnc1   Email dmwnc1   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Welcome to CT!

That is also the way I had heard it, that after her tow thru the Panama Canal she sank in the Pacific.

quote:
Originally posted by JohnHJ:
If memory serves correctly, the Angelina Lauro did not sink immediately after her fire in March of 79'. She sat in St. Thomas for several months before she was sold for scrap. In the summer of 79' she had been towed from St. Thomas and had successfully cleared the Panama Canal when some of her warped plates from the fire finally buckled and she started to take on water slowly. I believe she finally sank after foundering for a few days in September of 1979. I had the privilege of spending an afternoon on her in Port Everglades around 76' or so prior to her sale to Costa. She was a lovely ship with beautiful lines.

Posts: 5650 | From: Clarksburg WV | Registered: Apr 2003  |  IP: Logged
Neil - Ex P & O & PRINCESS CRUISES
First Class Passenger
Member # 5641

posted 03-25-2010 05:53 PM      Profile for Neil - Ex P & O & PRINCESS CRUISES   Author's Homepage   Email Neil - Ex P & O & PRINCESS CRUISES   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Hi dmwnc1

Great to see you have posted my picture of the Angelina Lauro on fire at St Thomas and also my one of her resting on the harbour bottom a week later with Pacific Princess entering the harbour behind her !

She did sink when under tow having been raised off the harbour floor at St Thomas.

My complete set of photos of Angelina Lauro on fire at St Thomas, including those posted in this section, is posted on the ss Maritime website in the ms Oranje section and were taken between when the fire started about 16.00 hrs and when we sailed at Midnight.

I was doing a relief trip on Sun Princess at the time of the fire and we took about 400 of her passengers back to San Juan, rather than leave them stranded in St Thomas.

A self service buffet dinner and a continental breakfast was provided for them and most of them slept in the International Lounge on the overnight crossing as all our passenger cabins were occupied.


Posts: 2355 | From: Dunstable, Bedfordshire. 30 miles north of London | Registered: May 2005  |  IP: Logged
Sutho
First Class Passenger
Member # 6234

posted 03-25-2010 07:11 PM      Profile for Sutho   Email Sutho   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Other factors for ships fire includes materials. The construction these days is preferred to use steel opposed to aluminium. I believe there is a standard rule in the US Navy today that all their ships must be constructed of steel as one of their ships suffered a serious fire and burnt to the water line. The ship was constructed of aluminium.

I was unaware at the time but apparantly Star Princess balcony structures are made of aluminium which is a material that is easier to catch fire than steel.


Posts: 1055 | From: Newcastle, Australia | Registered: Feb 2006  |  IP: Logged
Grant
First Class Passenger
Member # 1000

posted 03-25-2010 07:17 PM      Profile for Grant   Email Grant   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
all princess balconies have been retrofitted with: heat sensors, fire sprinklers, non combustable partitions (steel) and non combustable flooring. Passengers are reminded not to leave clothing etc on balconies. Some changes, hopefully enough!
Posts: 834 | From: Victoria, BC, Canada | Registered: Jan 2000  |  IP: Logged
JohnHJ
First Class Passenger
Member # 30846

posted 03-25-2010 08:56 PM      Profile for JohnHJ   Author's Homepage   Email JohnHJ   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Neil...or anyone else for that matter....does anyone know if photos exist of the Angelina Lauro sinking in the Pacific?
Posts: 60 | From: Tallahassee, FL | Registered: Jan 2010  |  IP: Logged

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