Manhattan couple booted from cruise over 'Jew slur' fight

By MELISSA KLEIN

Last Updated: 6:55 AM, October 3, 2010

Posted: 12:44 AM, October 3, 2010

A wealthy Manhattan couple was forced to walk the plank during a cruise on the Queen Mary 2 -- after getting into a bizarre fight with a fellow passenger, sources said.

Broadway producer Gloria Sher, 82, and her husband, Frederick Evans, 91, said they were ordered off the luxury liner after their obscenity-filled argument with someone they claim had made an anti-Semitic remark during a stately black-tie dinner.

The couple almost wound up stranded in a remote port in Quebec as punishment for their outburst. At the time, they were only days into the $20,000, five-week cruise.

They were eventually allowed to remain aboard for six more days after some passengers came to their defense, but they had to stay inside their cabin -- under house arrest. Even their booze was confiscated.

"I was treated with no respect and unbelievably rude and shockingly terrible," Sher said. "I've been sick ever since. It has ruined our lives. It's changed us forever."

Minutes into their meal that day, the couple said, one of their dining companions told Sher to shut up, then added, "There are too many Jews on board."

Sher, who is Jewish, admits she got angry, shooting back, "F- - k you!" and "How dare you insult me!" before storming off to her stateroom.

The next morning, the ship's captain, Commodore Bernard Warner, knocked on the couple's cabin door.

"You insulted a fellow passenger. I'm going to have to ask you to leave the ship," he said, quoting from a manual.

The couple, who met aboard the Queen Elizabeth 2 in 1991 and knew Warner from several trips on the QM2, were stunned, especially when he insinuated that the 95-pound Sher had pushed someone.

"He told two seniors we had to get off in Quebec and make our way home," said Sher, who produced the Tony-nominated musical "Shenandoah." "We begged him not to do this."

Evans, a former British navy man, said the commodore acted like a modern-day Captain Bligh, refusing to even listen to their side of the story.

But one passenger told The Post that the couple was at least partly to blame. Sher tends to get belligerent when drinking, the passenger said, recalling that she went on a rant one night because a lounge's piano was closed.

Another passenger, however, felt that the couple was definitely mistreated. Fred Bangasser, a retired Army colonel from Austin, Texas, who had befriended them during the cruise, tried to intervene when the commodore was giving them the heave-ho.

"This is deplorable," Bangasser said. "I felt that they were absolutely treated without appropriate dignity."

Warner allowed them to stay on board until the ship returned to New York, but only if they agreed not to leave their room.

The elderly couple spent six days as shut-ins, although they did manage to slip out of their suite once in a while.

It was hardly the royal treatment for two people known to make bold claims. Sher, for example, likes to tell people that her hubby is the illegitimate son of the Duke of Windsor, the abdicated King Edward VIII, as well as a British knight. Neither claim could be confirmed.

And she has her own colorful past. Her former husband, Louis K. Sher, owned a chain of art-house movie theaters and produced "The Stewardesses," a 1969 3-D soft-core porn flick.

The Cunard cruise line -- which would refund the couple only $839 -- said in a statement that "Sir Evans and Lady Sher engaged in multiple incidences of disrespectful and disruptive behavior towards crew members and other guests."

The statement added that Cunard "fully supported" the captain's decision.

Assuming the above is accurate, it's nice to see some accountability for a change regarding bad behavior. People need to realize there are consequences for their actions. If this couple were on an airplane, it's likely that not only would they have been booted from the airline, but face criminal charges as well.

As Ernie, said my initial feeling I also is that there is more to this story and this incident has just been the final drop.
You really need to behave extremely bad if you are summoned of a cruise ship. People tend to behave pretty uncivilized these days and staff is used to a lot.

No doubt a dishy yummy lawsuit will follow.....

Odds are defense counsel were already contacted by morning local time and Commodore Warner was acting on their advice, hence quoting from the manual and refusing to engage in conversation with the couple. I can also safely guess that the crew were "brusque" because they were also instructed against conversing with the couple.

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Originally posted by Lubber:

Odds are defense counsel were already contacted by morning local time and Commodore Warner was acting on their advice, hence quoting from the manual and refusing to engage in conversation with the couple.

It's a shame that a slur was the catalyst for this.

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Yes, I mentioned in the same in my post. I'm sure Cunard's legal department was consulted prior to any such action by the Captain.

Regarding the racial slur, well we are getting one side of the story on that one. This doesn't really address the issues of staff being abused. I'm quite certain there is more to this story, and it's very unlikely this couple are innocent in all this. Like Reint mentioned (and he and I both worked onboard ships), it takes some pretty extreme actions to be kicked off a ship.

The crew takes a lot of abuse day in and day out from passengers, but not to the point of expulsion from the ship. Most of it is just blown off by the company. I have to wonder if some of the poor treatment was directed at the ship's officers and not just crew, in which case the company may have been more willing to take action. It shouldn't be this way because a human being is a human being, but unfortunately that is the was society works.

Nobody talked to them during the cruise. Apparently he used the spiel on everyone. Night 7 of 10, the looked at a group of us in the Stratosphere lounge, wanting to join, nobody encouraged them and they were pissed!

When you resort to F)(&*Y*&^ it is like Archie Bunker's rasberry. I prefer a subtle approach and give the fool the floor so he falls on it.

How I would have handled it:

Sure mistakes have been made in the past such as that family Carnival tried to ban for scrathing a desk when it in fact they were not responsible for the damage.

This looks like that Cunard have gone to lengths to cover themselves.

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Originally posted by desirod7:
It was hardly the royal treatment for two people known to make bold claims. Sher, for example, likes to tell people that her hubby is the illegitimate son of the Duke of Windsor, the abdicated King Edward VIII, as well as a British knight. Neither claim could be confirmed.

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I wonder if they know what King Edward VIII was really like. Apparantly he was into heavy BDSM with his mistress whom he liked to take on dominatix roles as he crawled around on all fours behaving like a dog!

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Originally posted by desirod7:
On our last cruise on the Galaxy, there was a very pompous male couple from Australia both wearing huge crucifixes. One partner, about 5' tall and 3' wide was boasting and bragging about all of his business interests and asked me "what do you think the Jews will do to the world financial markets" Unlike the lady I cut him down so he would not realize it. I said back "I don't know, 2 Jews 3 opinions, and no pope to tell them what to think. The rabbis are not helpful since most are not versed in the complexities of high finance. Remember the man on the crosses you are wearing is Jewish" Later he tried to back out by noting the wonderful Jewish diamond merchants in Amsterdam he deals with.

Nobody talked to them during the cruise. Apparently he used the spiel on everyone. Night 7 of 10, the looked at a group of us in the Stratosphere lounge, wanting to join, nobody encouraged them and they were pissed!

When you resort to F)(&*Y*&^ it is like Archie Bunker's rasberry. I prefer a subtle approach and give the fool the floor so he falls on it.

How I would have handled it:

Too many Jews? Don't worry you still can have ham and shrimp. Turns out Cunard is owned by a Jew. But, you are right, being around all these Jews you all of a sudden get allergies and a craving for Bloomingdales.

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Oh well David I know there will be Jews out there, who do precisely the same toward other non Jews. Such as Hyacinth Buckets and People from New Jersey (Maasdam Bermuda treat) etc. etc.

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Originally posted by Maasdam:

Oh well David I know there will be Jews out there, who do precisely the same toward other non Jews. Such as Hyacinth Buckets and People from New Jersey (Maasdam Bermuda treat) etc. etc.

Greetings Ben.

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There is a house in Amsterdam on the Prinsengracht that is worth a visit.

Maasdam to Bermuda? Thou shalt not criticize HAL.

Ben, you and Roger try it mid July and let me know how you like it? The person who tried it and gave the scathing review is Dutch. It was not the dignified and sedate cruise format expected.

Hyacinth Bucket? she is a metaphor for American style social climbing in a country that is very class stratified. IMO also a not so subtle attack on Maggie Thatcher. She is a 2 edged sword: one: stay within your own kind. Two material display of wealth and being seen with the celebrated, boasting and bragging does not give one class.

[ 10-11-2010: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

Of course there is no excuse in the world for making rasist comments by anyone and rightly so should have been kicked off, here in SA it is a crime that comes with a potential jail sentence.

I decided that if I were to travel Cunard again I would have to wear shorts and a vest to dinner and get fake tatoos ! Give them something to moan about.

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Originally posted by mike sa:
In my experience Cunard attracts these types indeed the whole "White Star" formal thing seems to encourage them.

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I have exhorted many times about the exhumation of class separation of a ship within a ship. It is simply the newly rich or indebted looking down their nose at those who paid less.

Grille Class, Garden Villa, Carly Fiorina, Linda McMahon, Ron Johnson, and Carl Paladino as tablemates.

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I'd build a big tall house with rooms by the dozen,
Right in the middle of the town.
A fine tin roof with real wooden floors below.
There would be one long staircase just going up,
And one even longer coming down,
And one more leading nowhere, just for show.

I'd fill my yard with chicks and turkeys and geese and ducks
For the town to see and hear.
Squawking just as noisily as they can.
With each loud "cheep" "swaqwk" "honk" "quack"
Would land like a trumpet on the ear,
As if to say "Here lives a wealthy man."

I see my wife, my Golde, looking like a rich man's wife
With a proper double-chin.
Supervising meals to her heart's delight.
I see her putting on airs and strutting like a peacock.
Oy, what a happy mood she's in.
Screaming at the servants, day and night.

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Originally posted by desirod7:

There is a house in Amsterdam on the Prinsengracht that is worth a visit.

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Have visit het achterhuis several times and other locations linked to the Holocaust. My dad was victim of the Nazis and was deported to Germany and forced to work there. He was a shadow of what he was before he was deported. He also lived through the bombardment of Rotterdam loosing several of his family. My mother have several family members who where shot during the war and suffer in the last winter of hunger. My family do know what suffering is........!

But I do not talk a lot about it well I know that mostly my father was traumatized by the war.
Now I get the feeling you suggest that I'm discriminating against the Jews.

Ben.

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Originally posted by desirod7:

Maasdam to Bermuda? Thou shalt not criticize HAL.

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Wel go ahead I don't care!

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Ben, you and Roger try it mid July and let me know how you like it? The person who tried it and gave the scathing review is Dutch. It was not the dignified and sedate cruise format expected.

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We are not so narrow minded toward people and among the Dutch there are people to who are looking down on others. My father and mother always told us to try to look inside people and find the person behind the facade. I bet there where many other passengers that cruise who have a wonderful time.

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Hyacinth Bucket? she is a metaphor for American style social climbing in a country that is very class stratified. IMO also a not so subtle attack on Maggie Thatcher. She is a 2 edged sword: one: stay within your own kind. Two material display of wealth and being seen with the celebrated, boasting and bragging does not give one class.

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But dragging about the Hyacinths Buckets in this world is not classy to. Its actually preconception and downgrading toward people. You even made a picture with the name on the hull of the new QE.

Ben.

[ 10-11-2010: Message edited by: Maasdam ]

I wonder if ther was even an anti semitc remark made at all now. If this couple has the ability to use foul language like that and push others around, sureley they have the ability to invent stories that they were insulted or proviked.

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Originally posted by Sutho:
It just goes to show there is no difference in manners between the rich and elite and the slums in the poorest places on earth............................................................
I wonder if ther was even an anti semitc remark made at all now. If this couple has the ability to use foul language like that and push others around, sureley they have the ability to invent stories that they were insulted or proviked.
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The booted off couple handled the situation wrong. On our Summit cruise there were 2 sisters that fought all the time, hopefully they had a table for 2.
We exited the grossly mismanaged Balantyne terminal in Vancouver. One sister chewed out the shuttle dispatcher for 20 minutes at the top of her lungs just like you would expect from Estelle Costanza or Wilma Flintstone's mother. People around were laughing at her or looking in disgust. She got nowhere faster than we did by keeping our cool. A psychotherapist in our group noted "yelling and screaming is a sign or powerlessness"

I have been through places where language like she used is common place between people. Its unacceptable and I know the type.

It will be interesting if there is a follow up, or even if this couple decide to take the matter further.

That's fine, but that still leaves the crew to deal with them. Above and beyond not being raised with old-money couth and manners, much of the nouveau riche tend to be more demanding as customers, because they feel more entitled since they earned their station in life as opposed to simply inheriting it. Cruising is a full-immersion fantasy escape, so the bar for passenger's expectations is already high and threshold for abuse from passengers is already pretty close.

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Originally posted by desirod7:
Hyacinth Bucket? she is a metaphor for American style social climbing in a country that is very class stratified. IMO also a not so subtle attack on Maggie Thatcher. She is a 2 edged sword: one: stay within your own kind. Two material display of wealth and being seen with the celebrated, boasting and bragging does not give one class.

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My interpretation is different-- Hyacinth Bucket's fantasy is that she's from old money but was thrust upon hard times, so she has to "keep up appearances" on a working-class "pittance." There's not even any pretense of social climbing; she's resigned to her modest station in life even in her fantasy.

2.Its seems so ironic that the fellow pax mentiond "too many jews here" onboard a fully-Jewish ownership liner...

Rascism is bad in all matters and I think he should get a panishment for that insulting say...

We have heard no mention about the other people who allegedly made the remark or if they were kicked off too.

I am sure we have all been on cruises and heard rumours when someone has been kicked off.

Normally both parties are kicked off.

If this couple seriously were insulted and they reacted badly, you would think them and their insulters would both be booted.

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The couple, who are now demanding an apology from Cunard, claim they should have been given "far more regal treatment" because of their connections.

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Originally posted by FL_Cruiser64:

From: web page

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Originally posted by Lasuvidaboy:

I thought the real reason these old fools got kicked-off QM2 was that they were obnoxious to the captain when he went to their suite and the women (she is NO lady) poked him repeatedly in the chest w/her finger. I probably would have slapped that old hag across the face at that point!

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Bruce, during the incident Gloria threw a salt shaker at the Anti-Semite during the rant. When in a hole you stop digging

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Originally posted by desirod7:

Bruce, during the incident Gloria threw a salt shaker at the Anti-Semite during the rant.

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