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» Cruise Talk   » Technically Speaking   » Carnival Dream power plant...

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Author Topic: Carnival Dream power plant...
Atlantic
First Class Passenger
Member # 20971

posted 02-16-2009 04:00 PM      Profile for Atlantic        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Does anyone know anything about the "power plant" on the Carnival Dream? I have seen it being mentioned in differnt blogs and websites, but don't know what is so special about it.
Posts: 65 | From: Pinecrest, Fl | Registered: Feb 2009  |  IP: Logged
eroller
First Class Passenger
Member # 1649

posted 02-16-2009 08:26 PM      Profile for eroller     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I don't think there is anything special about it. To my understanding it will be basically the same as the Destiny/Conquest Class but slightly evolved, just like every addition to this class of ship.

Ernie


Posts: 7046 | From: Miami, Florida USA | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-19-2009 06:02 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
With all these monster ships being built I still waiting for the time when we have a nuke powered cruise ship. Some say that will never happen but they have said a lot of things that we now have!!
F4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-19-2009 06:17 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
With all these monster ships being built I still waiting for the time when we have a nuke powered cruise ship. Some say that will never happen but they have said a lot of things that we now have!!
F4

Personally, I am not in favor of nuclear reactors aboard ships. However, it's not a technical issue. Nuclear powered vessels are in service for many decades now and it would of in principle be possible to build a passenger vessel with a nuclear reactor. However it's practically impossible due to cost, legal and political issue. (mind you, a cruise ship is not a warship)
Licensing of new power plants ashore is a limiting factor for building new nuclear power plants in the U.S. - I don't even want to think about the complications of getting a nuclear reactor aboard a passenger vessel licensed. (if it's possible at all) Also, it's very likely not accepted by the public - and it's not only about the passengers but also about ports of call.


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
lasuvidaboy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4527

posted 02-19-2009 08:44 PM      Profile for lasuvidaboy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
We have'nt built a new nuclear power plant for over a generation here in the States due to political issues. The time will hopefully come sooner rather than later when we will have more of them them and like France generate a majority of our power from them. The current administration has flipped flopped about nuclear power during the campaign so we'll have to wait several more years before a discussion can begin about them again.
Posts: 7654 | From: Hollywood Hills/L.A. | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
eroller
First Class Passenger
Member # 1649

posted 02-19-2009 08:51 PM      Profile for eroller     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by lasuvidaboy:
We have'nt built a new nuclear power plant for over a generation here in the States due to political issues. The time will hopefully come sooner rather than later when we will have more of them them and like France generate a majority of our power from them. The current administration has flipped flopped about nuclear power during the campaign so we'll have to wait several more years before a discussion can begin about them again.


You roll your eyes at the current administration which has been in office less than a month. So what about the past administration these past eight years? It's not like they did anything to build new power plants.

Ernie


Posts: 7046 | From: Miami, Florida USA | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
desirod7
First Class Passenger
Member # 1626

posted 02-20-2009 11:44 AM      Profile for desirod7     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Trivia: The Leonardo Da Vinci and Le France were designed to be converted to nuclear power.

NS Savannah, recently talked about is a nuclear ship.


Posts: 5727 | From: Philadelphia, Pa [home of the SS United States] | Registered: Oct 2000  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-20-2009 12:09 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The question is if a nuclear powered ship would be more practical vs an oil based fuel powered vessel.
All politics aside I wonder what the cost differential would be. A ship like Oasis must use a fantastic amout of fuel on a 7 day cruise. Any guesses???
Comparing a US nuke carrier(which is pretty big)to an Oasis class ship might be a good check as to which one would be the most fuel efficent. Of course there is basically no burning of fuel in the case of a nuclear reactor-to some extent.
Frosty 4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-20-2009 12:52 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
The question is if a nuclear powered ship would be more practical vs an oil based fuel powered vessel.

It would be less practical.

quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:

All politics aside I wonder what the cost differential would be.

It would be substantially more expensive.

quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
[...]
Of course there is basically no burning of fuel in the case of a nuclear reactor-to some extent.
Frosty 4

That's of course not true at all. The nuclear fuel is also 'consumed' and it's not for free either.


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-20-2009 03:30 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I realize that the fuel rods in the reactor will need replacement. Cost of the rods vs all the gallons of oil based fuel is the question?? Over a period of time.I wonder how often rods are replaced on warships(maybe a military secret at best??)
I guess this whole question is based on the apparent effiency of the land based reactors vs coal or oil driven electic generation.
They say we should think about being"Green" . I have seen and there was talk by a recent presidential candidate about wind generated power.I believe his name was Pickens. Was he ever appointed by Obama to investigate setting up this array in the South and Midwest???
This is an interesting topic.
Frosty 4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 02-20-2009 04:11 PM      Profile for PamM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
.. and then what in a collision? There is no way any nuclear passenger vessel will be built as no port would allow such a vessel to call. If 2 nuclear subs can hit each other under the ocean what hope is there for anything floating; there would be nothing green about it.

Pam


Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
lasuvidaboy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4527

posted 02-20-2009 07:37 PM      Profile for lasuvidaboy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by eroller:


You roll your eyes at the current administration which has been in office less than a month. So what about the past administration these past eight years? It's not like they did anything to build new power plants.

Ernie


We have'nt had one built in over 30 years so there is plenty of blame to go around. At some point the Dems AND the GOP are going to have to ignore a few vocal environmentalists and start building them. Heck the more people know about the 800 billion dollar stimulus/pork package the more they hate that so what's a few nuclear power plants?


Posts: 7654 | From: Hollywood Hills/L.A. | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
lasuvidaboy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4527

posted 02-20-2009 07:42 PM      Profile for lasuvidaboy     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by eroller:


You roll your eyes at the current administration which has been in office less than a month. So what about the past administration these past eight years? It's not like they did anything to build new power plants.

Ernie


Ernie I rolled my eyes because the president talked for about a minute (during the campaign) about nuclear and quickly avoided the topic because some vocal environmentalists said no and he wanted the 'green' vote. Now it is dead until another administration opens the discussion because this one is not going to touch it w/a 10' pole.


Posts: 7654 | From: Hollywood Hills/L.A. | Registered: Mar 2004  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-20-2009 08:01 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It would be nice if someone from the cruise industry would tell us how much fuel is used by their cruise line in one year. It won't happen because enviormentalists would call it a waste of a precious resource or something to that effect. Wanting the ship builders to come up with a better fuel source.BTW most cruise ships are powered by electric motors (pods)but the generators that provide the power are still oil based fuels. The debate goes on!!
Frosty 4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-20-2009 08:15 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
It would be nice if someone from the cruise industry would tell us how much fuel is used by their cruise line in one year. It won't happen because enviormentalists would call it a waste of a precious resource or something to that effect.

It's actually easily available. You can even find some data on the internet - like e.g. at http://www.ship-technology.com/.

quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
[...]BTW most cruise ships are powered by electric motors (pods)but the generators that provide the power are still oil based fuels. The debate goes on!!
Frosty 4


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-20-2009 08:20 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by lasuvidaboy:
We have'nt built a new nuclear power plant for over a generation here in the States due to political issues. The time will hopefully come sooner rather than later when we will have more of them them and like France generate a majority of our power from them. The current administration has flipped flopped about nuclear power during the campaign so we'll have to wait several more years before a discussion can begin about them again.

quote:
Originally posted by eroller:


You roll your eyes at the current administration which has been in office less than a month. So what about the past administration these past eight years? It's not like they did anything to build new power plants.

Ernie



The process of preparing the construction of new new nuclear power plants in the U.S. has been started already during the past years - it will just take some time until the first new nuclear power plant can/will be built. See here.


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-20-2009 08:29 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by desirod7:
Trivia: The Leonardo Da Vinci and Le France were designed to be converted to nuclear power.

NS Savannah, recently talked about is a nuclear ship.


I never heard that about France but the conversion of Leonardo da Vinci to nuclear power would not really have been feasible - this was more a marketing gag.
Savannah was of course a demonstration vessels (like Otto Hahn) - I can not imagine that such ships could be built these days or in the near future nor would it make sens economically. There are however some nuclear powered 'merchant' (ice breakers) vessels presently in service - but that's another story.


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Atlantic
First Class Passenger
Member # 20971

posted 02-20-2009 08:41 PM      Profile for Atlantic        Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Talking about Nuclear Power...

FPL will raise our power costs in Florida even further in order to have enough funding to build a new nuclear reactor here in Turkey Point, Miami-Dade County by 2015.


Posts: 65 | From: Pinecrest, Fl | Registered: Feb 2009  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-21-2009 10:18 AM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
I went to the site recommended and took note of the fuel burned on Liberty OTS. --28.000gallons/hour!!! At that rate on a 7 day cruise it consumes approx. 4.7million gallons. In a year 244 million gallons.
We don't know what RCL pays for fuel/yr. but one wonders with all their ships how can they stay in business,build new ships and still charge a nominal amount for fares??
I think you get my drift as to going to a more economical fuel source.
Maybe I should have been a bean counter-NO offense to financial folks.
F4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 02-21-2009 11:03 AM      Profile for PamM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
I went to the site recommended and took note of the fuel burned on Liberty OTS. --28.000gallons/hour!!!

It does not say at what speed or under what conditions she consumes that amount of fuel, but even if we assume it's at cruising speed of 21.6kt, she does not do that 24/7. She is going to use much less most of the time.

Pam


Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
Frosty 4
First Class Passenger
Member # 5826

posted 02-21-2009 12:31 PM      Profile for Frosty 4   Email Frosty 4   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Even at half that rate(3/4 is probably more realistic) it's a LOT of fuel. It will be interesting to see if Oasis numbers are published.
Frosty 4

Posts: 2531 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005  |  IP: Logged
Ernst
First Class Passenger
Member # 5369

posted 02-21-2009 01:02 PM      Profile for Ernst   Author's Homepage   Email Ernst   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
I went to the site recommended and took note of the fuel burned on Liberty OTS. --28.000gallons/hour!!! [...]

This number is way off - it can't be correct. It looks like a typo to me: 2800 gallons per hour would make much more sense.


quote:
Originally posted by Frosty 4:
Even at half that rate(3/4 is probably more realistic) it's a LOT of fuel. It will be interesting to see if Oasis numbers are published.[...]

Beside that the number is very likely not correct - the power required for propulsion is increasing very heftily with the speed of the vessel - fuel consumption can easily drop 50 % just by decreasing the speed some knots. (not to talk about being in port) Beside that, Oasis of the Seas will very likely use less fuel per passenger than smaller vessels.


Posts: 9746 | From: Eindhoven | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 02-21-2009 01:54 PM      Profile for PamM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
What we are really looking at, rounding figures, is one gallon per hour per passenger at top speed. [Mariner of the Seas quotes 2780g/hr at top speed 24 kts].

Cost? Bunkers are priced in tons

Pam


Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged

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