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» Cruise Talk   » Cruise Lines   » HAL sued for bilking passengers

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Author Topic: HAL sued for bilking passengers
Joe99
First Class Passenger
Member # 3931

posted 09-23-2006 03:45 AM      Profile for Joe99     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This might have more merit than some of the other lawsuits.

Here


Posts: 51 | From: midwest | Registered: Jun 2003  |  IP: Logged
Cambodge
First Class Passenger
Member # 906

posted 09-23-2006 10:04 AM      Profile for Cambodge   Email Cambodge   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Sounds as if the HAL halo might have slipped a bit.
Posts: 2149 | From: St. Michaels MD USA , the town that fooled the British! | Registered: Nov 1999  |  IP: Logged
Caronia II
First Class Passenger
Member # 5223

posted 09-23-2006 11:53 AM      Profile for Caronia II     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
It's blatant fraud and the line should get slapped for it, but the fish stinks at the head, and if this isn't a mandate by Carnival, then I don't know what would be. This could easily cause an industry wide investigation...
Posts: 181 | From: LA-ish | Registered: Nov 2004  |  IP: Logged
Tim in Fort Lauderdale
First Class Passenger
Member # 953

posted 09-23-2006 12:08 PM      Profile for Tim in Fort Lauderdale     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
This isn't outright fraud, it's simply frivilous litigation. U.S. cabotage law requires the cruise lines to collect the fines associated with the Jones Act, plain and simple. HAL was just following the letter of the law. If the U.S. gov't didn't collect the fines, then HAL should have been instructed by them to return them.

As for the shore excursions, this is ludicrous. All businesses are 'for profit' entities and to think that any cruise line or assciated tour operator is not making money on these is just plain idiotic.

Tim


Posts: 1468 | From: Fort Lauderdale, FL | Registered: Dec 1999  |  IP: Logged
LeBarryboat
First Class Passenger
Member # 5308

posted 09-23-2006 12:48 PM      Profile for LeBarryboat   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In the old days as Cruise Director, we personally got kick-backs for promoting a particular shop or restaurant in the ports. I personally collected these kick-backs and it was a suite deal for the Cruise Director. It often meant several thousand dollars a week extra pay. It's not a new practice and I've heard that in the last ten or fifteen years or so, the cruise line corporate offices have tuned into this extra revenue source. I guess the S*** had to hit the fan eventually when passengers found out about this.
Posts: 1955 | From: Minnesota | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged
Linerrich
First Class Passenger
Member # 4864

posted 09-23-2006 01:07 PM      Profile for Linerrich   Email Linerrich   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
quote:
Originally posted by LeBarryboat:
In the old days as Cruise Director, we personally got kick-backs for promoting a particular shop or restaurant in the ports. I personally collected these kick-backs and it was a suite deal for the Cruise Director. It often meant several thousand dollars a week extra pay. It's not a new practice and I've heard that in the last ten or fifteen years or so, the cruise line corporate offices have tuned into this extra revenue source. I guess the S*** had to hit the fan eventually when passengers found out about this.

What happened was the cruise lines themselves decided to profit from what used to be the cruise directors' racket. I worked for a couple of years as On-Board Port Lecturer, promoting the recommended shops. One of my duties was collecting the 'advertising fees' from the recommended shops in each port; said revenue went to the Home Office.

Rich


Posts: 4210 | From: Miami, FL | Registered: Jul 2004  |  IP: Logged
TBirdFrank
First Class Passenger
Member # 2280

posted 09-23-2006 03:02 PM      Profile for TBirdFrank     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
In Britain I would have got fired from my job, and probably have lost my accrued rights, if I had engaged in any such activity whilst engaged in my employers business - and rightly so.

There is nothing sweet, or savoury about kickbacks

They are simply the first and worst step on the road to bribery and corruption, and as a blatant restriction on free trade, as customer unfriendly as it gets


Posts: 158 | From: Manchester, England | Registered: Aug 2001  |  IP: Logged
PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 09-23-2006 03:22 PM      Profile for PamM   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
The suit is not talking about kickbacks from shop recommendations, but pofiteering re the cost of shore excursions. The guy is whinging because his fishing trip cost more than he could have purchased the same for ashore...

Now quite why HAL or any cruiseline are not in their rights to do this I am not sure. There are staff to pay... HAL have done the research, HAL have arranged the tours, HAL have printed all their excursion leafelts, booklets, have shore excursions staff and so on... so yes, the cost to them is certainly more than the cost of the excursion, so a pax should get a bumped up price... as he has done nothing to arrange it. It he had wanted to arrange it himself it may have taken him a few hours work. Now HAL would also be entitled to a bit of profit as well... how much is their business. Most cruisers know they have a choice between going alone or with the cruisline and the pros and cons of one or the other.

Alaska have supposedly passed a law to ensure cruiselines tell their pax what the mark-up is, which HAL apparently haven't done; but I also read elswhere that the actual law has not yet come into effect? I have no idea there.

Re the PSA fee, HAL acted within the law.. if the fee has not been charged to HAL then it's not their fault but a govn't error... which may eventually be rectified. I am not sure how the pax or his lawyer know that the govn't have not sent out the bill. If HAL gave the money back without the govn't telling them to do so, when a bill eventually arrived, one can see the pax would not cough up.

Re the shopping kickbacks as TBird says.. most people here would have been sacked. I was not permitted to accept a single item from any client/customer.. it would have been deemed bribery. This is one reason why I abhor the practise of some pax who hand their steward a tip on day one feeling proud they will get extra service because of it. It's bribery, nothing more. I would also make a point of not shopping in any named shops.

Pam


Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001  |  IP: Logged
lambcom
First Class Passenger
Member # 656

posted 09-23-2006 03:51 PM      Profile for lambcom   Email lambcom   Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
On a cruise a number of years ago, we were in Saint Thomas, which has to be cruise ship kickback heaven. We were walking down the main drag and came to a rather nice looking jewelery/perfume emporium which had the following sign in the window "our prices are lower because we don't pay kickbacks to cruise lines and their staff".

We were sold on the spot!

George+


Posts: 179 | From: Montreal, canada | Registered: Jul 99  |  IP: Logged
JP
First Class Passenger
Member # 1373

posted 09-23-2006 05:07 PM      Profile for JP     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
Isn't it a little early to judge the merits of this case, based solely on a press release by the firm filing the complaints?

Who knows, maybe it will turn out that the people who say they were fined are lying, or misunderstood what they were being charged for?


Posts: 280 | From: Minnesota, USA | Registered: Jun 2000  |  IP: Logged
LeBarryboat
First Class Passenger
Member # 5308

posted 09-23-2006 10:41 PM      Profile for LeBarryboat   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message      Edit/Delete Post  Reply With Quote 
When I worked as CD in the Mexican Riviera, it was common practice to set up a kick-back program with vendors it is the expected business practice in Mexico...a cultural method of doing business.

Of course HAL marks-up the cost of shore excursions in Alaska...in fact HAL has one of the most solid shore ex programs in Alaska. Passengers can expect a certain level of professionalism and quality because they run many of the shore excursion businesses in Alaska. I am always confident to book my customers on HAL Alaska because I know that they will be hand-held during the whole cruise and excursions experience. HAL has the most carefully planned out excursions in Alaska.

It will be interesting to see how this will all pan out.


Posts: 1955 | From: Minnesota | Registered: Jan 2005  |  IP: Logged

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