I am dissapointed with RCL this is a new low for them. They had no reason to activate this program they had a very loyal following or did they? Was it fear of its competitors? Insecurity of its product? Or just shear arrogance? I belive the latter. What do you think is this crossing the line or not?

www.expertcruiser.com

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Originally posted by Cam J:
[...] What do you think is this crossing the line or not?[...]

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Originally posted by Ernst:

Since you seem to be on a similar mission for Carnival I wonder how you feel about that.

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[ 08-05-2009: Message edited by: nycruiser ]

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Originally posted by Cam J:
For those of you who dont know what the Royal Champions club is its a group of people that RCL has "hired" basically to post only positive comments on on sites such as Cruisecritic and Trip Advisor.com. They get free RCL cruises and major discounts on RCL cruises.

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As usual it doesn't sound like you have a full understanding of the program, and like your friend John Heald you seem to take any opportunity to post something negative about any non-Carnival Corp. cruise brand. In the case of Heald, it's really tacky and I have lost all respect for the man. He comes across sounding more jealous than anything. Rather pathetic actually and very much on the defensive. I imagine deep down he knows Royal Caribbean ships blow Carnival out of the water and that must be hard to take. He has also stated many negative things about NCL and EPIC. Don't tell me this is not endorsed by Carnival as basically his blog is nothing more than advertising for Carnival. Heald is certainly getting paid for it one way or another .... kind of like the Royal Champions come to think of it.

At least I don't have to read negative comments about Carnival on Richard Fain or Adam Goldstein's blog. They concentrate on their own product which of course is the decent thing to do.

FYI the reason I have brought up Heald's blog is it just so happens today he talks about the Royal Champions. Interestingly enough, our new regular Cam J also posts today on CT the same story. Coincidence?

Ernie

[ 08-05-2009: Message edited by: eroller ]

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Originally posted by nycruiser:
Actually I view this as steps ALL major cruise lines are taking to remove travel agents out of the equation. They were trying to create a sales force of sorts in place of front line travel agents. I think it was a flawed system but I think they will tweak it and it will return in another shape or form. Speaking as a former Travel Agent of 10 years I beleive the cruise industry is doing their best to slowly phase out agents. They have realised tthat message boards especially *****critic atracts large amounts of cruisers epescially 1st timers all of which who brag how they just book direct why bother using a travel agent. IMO I see it as a way to let go of travel agents. Cruise lines want the agent commissions for themselves.

[ 08-05-2009: Message edited by: nycruiser ]

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I think Travel Agents are essential to the cruise industry. But I also think most people would rather plan their own cruise. Ive been on 14 cruises and ive only used travel agents on about 2 or 3. In the end its a personal choice and its one less thing to worry about for the passengers, and more money for the cruise lines. Unfortunately.

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Originally posted by dmwnc1:
It's up to the individual to do enough personal reseach to make an informed decision, and not just relying on any one particular source or sources.

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Well said. If anyone really bought into the Royal Champions as anything more than just another source of information then it's their own naivety. I mean who would let an anonymous stranger on the internet influence their discretionary spending decisions? Of course there are some people that would, and they would probably deserve whatever they get.

The Royal Champions were a very small group of people with access to a very, very small percent of the Royal Caribbean cruising population. Basically people that frequented the RCI message board section of Cruise Critic. They were really nothing more than advocates for the brand. Personally I did not agree with the RC program, but it wasn't something that really bothered me either. I'm a grown man that can make my own informed decisions without outside influences. If the RC's liked what they were doing, were providing accurate information and actually helping some cruisers, then so be it. If they got a little recognition in return then more power to them.

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Originally posted by eroller:

As usual it doesn't sound like you have a full understanding of the program, and like your friend John Heald you seem to take any opportunity to post something negative about any non-Carnival Corp. cruise brand. In the case of Heald, it's really tacky and I have lost all respect for the man. He comes across sounding more jealous than anything. Rather pathetic actually and very much on the defensive. I imagine deep down he knows Royal Caribbean ships blow Carnival out of the water and that must be hard to take. He has also stated many negative things about NCL and EPIC. Don't tell me this is not endorsed by Carnival as basically his blog is nothing more than advertising for Carnival. Heald is certainly getting paid for it one way or another .... kind of like the Royal Champions come to think of it.

At least I don't have read negative comments about Carnival on Richard Fain or Adam Goldstein's blog. They concentrate on their own product which of course is the decent thing to do.

FYI I have brought up Heald's blog as it just so happens today he talks about the Royal Champions. Interestingly enough, Cam J also posts today on CT the same story. Coincidence?

Ernie

[ 08-05-2009: Message edited by: eroller ]

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Ernie if I dont have a full understanding of what Royal Champions is and obviously you do then tell me what Royal champions is since im wrong.

As for John Healds blog if you dont like him why do you read his blog? I know if I didnt like someone I wouldnt read their blog. Dont you think if Heald didnt want to work for Carnival he wouldnt? Obviously he enjoys working at Carnival or why would he be working at a place where he doesnt want to be for so long?

Also Yes I did read Healds blog today and I did get my idea for this post from his blog. So What! I just think RCL is wrong for doing this, it was unnessecary and im glad they are terminating the program.

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Originally posted by Cam J:

As for John Healds blog if you dont like him why do you read his blog? I know if I didnt like someone I wouldnt read their blog.

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I read his blog because I have an interest in the cruise industry, all sides of the cruise industry. Also, in the beginning before his blog became just another marketing avenue for Carnival, it was actually quite interesting. Now I read it because it's intriguing to see what Carnival filters through this blog.

If you really want to know what the RC's were all about, there is plenty of more balanced information available through various web sources. You seem to prefer the more one-sided approach. In fact one of our frequent posters on CT was a RC. He may decide to chime in and truly educate you on what he felt his role was. One thing is for certain, you seem to have a major agenda and unfortunately that kind of one-sidedness lacks credibility for many people. If you were so offended by the Royal Champion program, why is this the first time you are posting about it? Did you even know it existed before reading about it on Heald's blog?

As for Heald getting a job at another cruise line, well I'm not so sure about that even if he wanted to. Perhaps another Carnival Corp brand, but I can't imagine a better fit for him then CCL. Read into that what you will.

Ernie

[ 08-05-2009: Message edited by: eroller ]

Over and Out,
Cam J

[ 08-06-2009: Message edited by: Cam J ]

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Originally posted by Cam J:
For those of you who dont know what the Royal Champions club is its a group of people that RCL has "hired" basically to post only positive comments on on sites such as Cruisecritic and Trip Advisor.com. They get free RCL cruises and major discounts on RCL cruises. Just to say only positive things about RCL. ..........

Over and Out,
Cam J

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Look at NCL buying the ‘SS United States’. Absolutely NO ONE in the industry though the idea of returning such an old ship back to service, practical or economically viable.

Some commentators suggest that NCL only purchased her in order to take the only remaining American Hull off the market. This was a precaution, just in case someone else purchased her in order to set up in competition to NCL America.

Personally I don't think NCL were ever serious about their plans to return her back to service. I wonder if the so called 'viability studies' were even done? She's far too small to be economical, for starters. They were a multitude of difficulties about fitting modern cabins, installing modern lifeboats, new engines, and even her hull stability.

While we were still wondering what progress NCL had made with the Big - U, they were busy planning the 'F3' sisters.

[ 08-06-2009: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

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Originally posted by Malcolm @ cruisepage:
Sometimes businesses play a little dirty in their pursuit of profits.

Look at NCL buying the ‘SS United States’. Absolutely NO ONE in the industry though the idea of returning such an old ship back to service, practical or economically viable. [...]

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So my first HAL THEY ARE THE BEST. HAL THEY ARE THE BEST. Now waiting to see where my next cruise go to to

Fore non HAL fans just added you're favorite line.

Back in March of 2007 I along with about 35 other members received an email from the administrator of Cruise Critic. It seems that she was contacted by Royal Caribbean and they wanted my contact information(email address) about the possibility of going on a two night Pre Inaugural cruise on the then new Liberty of the Seas. After asking about the legitimacy of the message I of course said "no problem" and they contacted me and extended the invitation.

Once on board Richard Fain and Adam Goldstein hosted a small gathering up in the Viking Crown lounge prior to sail away and explained that RCI had hired a marketing company to read the different cruise boards and choose folks who posted positive comments about Royal Caribbean and cruising in general. Cruise Critic was not the only site that members were chosen from but about 75% did come from this site due to the large number of members that CC has. Other sites like rec.travel.cruises on Usenet was also involved. A total of about 50 people were chosen for the initial group. Keep in mind that we were chosen for our comments BEFORE being named "Royal Champions" by Mr. Fain and Mr. Goldstein.

We were given this two night cruise which included an open bar, accommodations on board ship, pre paid gratuities and our parking at the port. We paid our own way down to Miami, hotels, etc. This is same cruise that was mainly populated with travel agents, members of the media and other special guests who were receiving the exact same treatment as us. We were about fifty RC's in a sea of about 4000 guests.

That was the only time that I was given anything by Royal Caribbean. I do know that a few of the RC's that lived on the west coast were given either a one or two night cruise on the Mariner after her trip around the Horn and prior to her debut in LA. We were also invited to an Oasis reveal in New York back in June of last year. We paid our own way to New York including hotel accommodations, food, etc. The only thing that RCI gave us were two tickets to the two hour reveal. Nothing else. We were also invited to try out a new site that RCI was looking to launch. Basically we were their test team. We were also asked one time to submit our dream cruise and that it might be used in an upcoming article for their quarterly magazine. That is the extent of the what the Royal Champions were given. At the last reveal in Ft Lauderdale for the Oasis which involved the Aqua Theater, two RC's were invited due to their Crown and Anchor status, not their status as an RC. Both have over 50 cruise credits with RCI and lived in the state within driving distance. Many of the Royal Champions were Diamond Plus with RCI. RCI also invites many of the Diamond Plus on their Pre Inaugural cruises. Also just prior to this entire thing blowing up in the media, RCI had just selected another round of Royal Champions. Again, many were from Cruise Critic. Those folks received nothing, nada.

For me, I did not change the way that I posted after being named a Royal Champion. I cruised Carnival for many years until I felt that the product was heading south along with having a very bad experience aboard one of their ships that Carnival chose to ignore and stepped out to try something else. Moved over to Royal Caribbean in 2004 and never looked at Carnival again and won't. Do I like Carnival? No. Do I post negative things about them? Yes and I don't try to hide this. Again I did this before being named a Royal Champion. This(me) Royal Champion also cruised NCL in 2007, HAL in 2008 and NCL again just last month. I also blasted RCI last year in a review on Cruise Critic after a very bad debarkation on the Navigator in Ft. Lauderdale and yes I also told the good things that I enjoyed about Royal Caribbean. All of the above while having the "Royal Champion" name. The color of my spots did not change at any time.

We received an email about a week ago stating that Royal Caribbean had decided to go in a new direction and that the Royal Champion program was now a thing of the past. This email did not come as a surprise considering how much heat RCI took over this program. At no time during this program did Royal Caribbean tell us how to post, what to post or when to post. At no time did they tell us that we had to conduct our self in any certain manner on the boards. At no time did they tell us that we were to attack their competition. At no time did we receive any other type of compensation including pay, reduced fares or free cruises other than what I mentioned earlier in my post. If we were being give all of those free cruises and huge discounts then why would folks such as myself be out there cruising with NCL and HAL?

Most of the stuff that has been posted by the media or on the cruise boards has been untrue and started by folks who think that they have all of the information and in reality have been 100% incorrect. I saw this post last night and decided to click off of it as I am really tired of trying to explain the "other" side but I felt that I would tell it one more time because I respect the members of this board more than I do any other cruise site because I think that this board represents what cruising is all about and members of this board actually "get" cruising.

I apologize for the long winded post but the above is one side of the story coming from a former Royal Champion. Will I continue to cruise with Royal Caribbean now that this program has been canceled? You bet. Will I also cruise other lines? You bet. Nothing has changed.

Gordon

[ 08-06-2009: Message edited by: Atlcruiser ]

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Originally posted by dmwnc1:
Altcruiser, Thank You for coming forward. At first I was shocked, but your rather detailed explanation really set things straight. Quite enlightening I must say.... Thanks again.

As far as I am concerned 'no harm, no foul'.

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Thank you.

I will also add one more thing. When we received the invite to the Liberty cruise, we posted openly about it on Cruise Critic. We even had a roll call going as we were given a choice of going out of New York or Miami for the PI cruise. When we returned from the cruise, many of us added the name "Royal Champion" to our sig line and even kept it there after the bomb fell as we were not trying to hide anything. After receiving the invitation to the reveal in New York, we openly posted about it on the board. At no time did we ever try to keep anything a secret nor were we told to by RCI. It seemed that no one had an issue with this until the media got wind of a statement made by a Royal Caribbean associate and then all hell broke loose. Suddenly we were the bad guys and RCI was this sleazy company. Oh well, it's over now and hopefully most will be able to move on. I know that I have.

[ 08-06-2009: Message edited by: Atlcruiser ]

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Originally posted by Atlcruiser:
I'm the Royal Champion that Ernie was referring to. I will set the record straight on this program,

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Thank you Gordon for sharing your first hand experience with this program, and also setting the facts straight. A great example why you shouldn't believe everything you read on a competitors blog.

As I mentioned before, I was not in favor of the RC program. I felt this way because the program was doing more harm than good for RCI's reputation, not because I felt it was unethical. In the end I think RCI felt the same way I did, and realized there were too many misconceptions about the program for it to retain any credibility.

Again this is another way RCI thinks outside the box, which is why I admire them so much as a company. Sometimes the innovative ideas work, and sometimes they don't, but at least they are willing to take some risks and try new things. Speaking of which, the new lifeboat drill procedures sound fantastic! No more running back to your cabin for a life jacket.

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Originally posted by eroller:

[....] Speaking of which, the new lifeboat drill procedures sound fantastic! No more running back to your cabin for a life jacket.

Ernie

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As for "spin", well it's not like RCI put out some worldwide press release. They simply mentioned it on a blog. If industry press organizations decided to run a story on it that is their doing.