Welcome to Cruise Talk the Internet's most popular discussion forum dedicated to cruising. Stop by Cruise Talk anytime to post a message or find out what your fellow passengers and industry insiders are saying about a particular ship, cruise line or destination.
>>> Reader Reviews >>> CruisePage.com Photo Gallery >>> Join Our Cruise Club.
Latest News...Disney Cruise Line announced today that the honorary role of "godparent" for its new ship, the Disney Treasure, will be held by The Walt Disney Company cast, crew, Imagineers and employees around the world. The profound declaration is a heartfelt tribute to the more than 200,000 dreamers and doers who make every Disney entertainment, vacation and at-home experience possible. Disney Cruise Line is proud to celebrate...
Latest News...Carnival Cruise Line is adding to its line-up of 2026/27 deployment with sailings from New York City on Carnival Venezia, and more Long Beach sailings on Carnival Firenze and Carnival Radiance. “Our two Carnival Fun Italian Style ships offer great options from the east and west coasts, conveniently connecting New York and Long Beach to popular destinations, while delivering unique experiences on board...
Latest News...Vacationers are in for more ways to make memories across Royal Caribbean’s latest combination of tropical and Northeast 2026-27 getaways. The lineup of 12 Royal Caribbean ships rounds out a variety of adventures across Florida, Texas, Puerto Rico and the Northeast for every type of family and vacationer to get away any time of year. Crown & Anchor Society loyalty members...
"A major US cruise line is considering an overhaul of its on board tipping arrangements due to the reluctance of British passengers to pay gratuities to staff.
Royal Caribbean International vice president and UK managing director Robin Shaw disclosed that the payment of gratuities to renumerate cruise ship employees had become a “significant issue”.Speaking at the first Cruise Forum as part of the ABTA Travel Convention in Barcelona, Shaw said the company was experiencing a “huge cultural difference” between US passengers who are used to tipping for service and those from the UK who are not.
He admitted that cruise ship staff received far less tips when British passengers are on board.This comes at a time when the company is committing one of its largest ships, Independence of the Seas, to year-round ex-UK sailings from the end of next year and introducing the first summer season of Celebrity Cruises' departures from Southampton on new ship Celebrity Eclipse in 2010.Addressing the issue of paying gratuities – seen by UK consumers as a negative to taking a cruise – Shaw said: “We are evaluating what our options can be in the UK. This is certainly a challenge for us and one we have to address.”
His comments came as part of a wider discussion on add-ons cruise companies charge on top of the holiday price for items such as speciality restaurant meals and other extras.
Shaw said it was almost impossible to cost everything into the up front price, but it was a “commercial reality” that on board revenue was a key component for cruise lines to recover their return on investment .
Journalist Jane Archer, cruise writer for the Daily Telegraph, had pinpointed gratuities and on board add-ons as among the “turn-offs” for cruise passengers, saying that there was a perception that people were paying for more things as lines added optional extras to new ships.
She described cruise line tipping polices as “antiquated” and something that can lead to resentment and upset amongst travellers."
by Phil Davies (Travelmole)
[ 10-10-2009: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]
I would guess that if it were factored into the fare you would get no complaints.
I have also noted that the recommended amount on P&O is far less than what Princess recommends.
We accepted cash for most purchases on board and did not run an accounts system.
The New Zealand passengers - Well !
It's that simple.
Tim
quote:Originally posted by Sutho:I would guess that if it were factored into the fare you would get no complaints.I have also noted that the recommended amount on P&O is far less than what Princess recommends.
Sutho, I disagree. If the tips are 'included' they must be disclosed and many then demand a refund of them out of their fare.
Its not as if tips are a new thing, even Uganda had a tipping system as did the old TransAtlantic liners etc.
Well IMHO all Brits and Aussies (and any others)should simply get a grip, tips are a fact of life and you are VERY well aware that it is part of the deal before you get on the ship, simply budget for them and pay. To not pay is insulting, hurtful and nothing less taking advantage of those less well off than yourselves and those who don't pay should be very ashamed of themselves AND if it were up to me I would publish the names of those who don't. And without putting to fine a point on it - PAY UP all you skinflint tightwad moaning so & so's ! After all it is not ice rinks etc that make a great cruise, it is the crew slaving away for you.
If you don't like it, holiday in Benidorm but stay off our ships. Most of us would possibly be quite happy to pay a bit extra to make up for your not being there and the service will be fab.
PS Nothing personal against any individual but one subject guaranteed to get me going. as you may have noticed.
quote:Originally posted by Tim in 'Lauderdale:Then they should not cruise on ships that cater to North Americans. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.It's that simple. Tim
Funny-that is exactly what I was thinking of writing even before I read any of the reponses...when forgeign guests take cruises out of the US.
But with that said, if US based cruise lines are going to reposition their fleet to do cruises in regions where they know the bulk of the guests will be UK or AUS then they need to tailor their policies to minimize guest dissatisfaction - especially since they know it is an issue going into the market to begin with.
[ 10-10-2009: Message edited by: Jekyll ]
quote:Originally posted by mike sa:Well IMHO all Brits and Aussies (and any others)should simply get a grip, tips are a fact of life and you are VERY well aware that it is part of the deal before you get on the ship, simply budget for them and pay. To not pay is insulting, hurtful and nothing less taking advantage of those less well off than yourselves and those who don't pay should be very ashamed of themselves AND if it were up to me I would publish the names of those who don't. And without putting to fine a point on it - PAY UP all you skinflint tightwad moaning so & so's !
There is only 1 cruise where I've ever asked for the tips to be removed, and on that the service was so bad there was no way I was paying - apart from an appropriate gesture to the room steward who was good.
Many of the non-tippers may not realise that the tips are an essential part of the incomes of the staff, in Britain that isn't necessarily the case and there is a new law being introduced to make sure tips actually go to the staff and not the owners. But those who know the score, receive the service and still don't pay - sorry but no excuse in my view.
Some compagnies as Costa didn't talk about the tips in their french brochures. But, they add "un forfait de séjour à bord" (a contract of stay aboard) who reprent the tips. It's obligatory, and any passenger can't change the amount.But many french passengers don't agree with this system and prefer the TTC price, as me.
I think it's the latter one that hurts the most. Especially looking at the price of drinks: glasses of wine started at $5.50 for the house specials, but most were in the 7/8/9/10 $ range - some were more. Ad another 15% to that and it's getting expensive. Actually, it's getting very expensive: a $8 glass of pretty ordinary red wine rounds up to $9.20 which is going to be around £6.00. Worst of all, I don't know how much I'm getting - there's no definition of 'a glass' and the actual amounts poured varied quite a lot.
And why is it 15%? Why not a fixed amount per drink? After all, pouring a glass of wine is the same amount of work whether it's a $5 or $50 for a glass.
Most companies now employ staff at concession rates of pay with the results that the tips are making up any shortfalls in pay.
Previously the Goanese on the P & O cruise ships were paid a monthly wage which was slightly above the Indian seamans agreed rates of pay.
They were also paid overtime for all hours worked over four hours on a Saturday and overtime for all hours work on a Sunday.
The daily working day was eight hours and any hours worked in excess of eight hours were at overtime rates.
Any tips they received, from their passengers, were then in addition to a proper wage !
quote:Originally posted by Tim in 'Lauderdale:Then they should not cruise on ships that cater to North Americans. When in Rome, do as the Romans do.It's that simple.
With respect Tim, us Brits are not in 'Rome', Rome comes to the UK each each! American lines are trying their best to cater for us Brits, not just North Americans.
American ships want a slice of the UK market (the second biggest cruise market) and our dislike of the tipping system means that they have dissatisfied UK passengers (and staff).
It's not so much that we demand change, RCI must feel that a fare include of tips will improve UK cruise bookings. Thomson manage to achieve excellent service on board their ships with a no-tipping policy.
quote:Originally posted by Tom Burke:...and of course +15% on all drinks bills, etc.I think it's the latter one that hurts the most.
Yes Tom, this is another major moan on the UK cruise forums. I'm sure that this is costing American lines UK passengers. Many Brits seem to be selecting Thomson and Olsen because of their reasonable drink prices which are not unlike UK pub prices. People argue that as the ships get the alcohol duty free, charging high prices is simply a rip-off. (The £ to $ exchange rate don't help either).Many Brits also select Thomson because of their no tipping policy.
Brits are voting with their feet and it is obviously hurting the US lines.
Cam J
My mate has become a chav what can i do? answer is shoot him before it is too late
quote:Originally posted by avalon1025:add $77/week and call it a day, whats the difference?
A bit bone amongst UK cruisers too is also that they have probably paid far more for their cruise than any US citizens on the same trip [on a US line wherever they are sailing] & often feel they have more than covered this extra charge [even though some of this additional fare is to cover the various required bonds in the UK]. Look at the lines which do not permit one to book across the pond. Cunard is a prime example. At times the $ v £ rates differ quite a lot.
Pam
quote:Originally posted by Cam J:What is a Chav?Cam J
Cam, probably the closest equivalent to a Chav that we have in the States would be a "Guido."
Rich
How does an average European cruiser who books with a TA in the High Street or who books a cruise with a TA online know to which public the cruise line is targeted for??? They just book a cruise and that's how far as it goes. Most people haven't got a clue about these things.
Tim, as a cruise executive you should know better!!! ;-)
Anyway personally I don't mind paying tips. The crew needs it and really deserves it and I usually pay far more than recommended. I don't like this charging it to my account as I like to give it myself the old fashioned way. I just don't know if the crew really gets the full amount. Having worked years ago as a junior waiter at the London Ritz I know once management gets their hands on the til they leave peanuts to the junior staff. But i do understand why cruise lines are doing this.
In general we are not so much used to tipping here as we have by law minimum wage requirements and it is just seen as an extra.
But as cruising goes more international and expands to different markets it is one of the cultural difference issue the cruiselines have to deal with. It has proven this thought " this is how we do it in the States" doesn't go well with us at times. For example once on an Atlantis cruise at a deck party you fetch your own drinks at the bar (like in a nightclub) but still get charged an 18 percent service charge. We just do not tip bartenders here and find it really odd.
Another phenomenon is all general irritation with extra hidden charges. We have a low cost airline called Ryanair here in Europe and they stretch this to a absolute maximum where in the end you feel just screwed. I feel a lot of people see this too with added tips on their account (incorrectly I may add)
I would say just include it in the cruise fare like Thompson does. The crew would get something extra from me in hand anyway :-)
It gets more complex: Many of us would tip 10% in a restaurant, but we do not generally tip bar staff at all. We would not tip professionals like teachers and Nurses, but we might well tip a Black Cab driver. Curiously Teachers and Nurses may well ear less than a Black Cab driver.
It's like our VAT (sales Tax): If something cost £2, we pay £2 - the price includes the 17.5% tax (or whatever it is now?), it's rarely show as an extra for the public.
Confused?
By the way American's have better booking conditions for cruises than we do. We often pay 10% deposit which we loose if we cancel plus other penalties as the departure date draws closer. Traditionally if the price drops after booking we have not got a refund.
If the Romans jumped off a cliff I guess you would be doing the same!
I certainly dont care about the 15% bar tax for drinks. That is technically what happens in Australia (although the seller does not have to disclose what percentage covers profits/wages etc.
For some reasons the workplace laws are so far advanced in Australia that everyone is highly paid. We dont tip taxi drivers. Most Australians staying in a hotel here dont tip at all. I think major hotels advertise for tips to make overseas passengers feel comfortable. There are tipping jars in restaurants where people leave lose change like 5c, 10c or 50c.
With regards to tipping nationalities it appears the ones against it or who dont or rarely tip are:BritainAustraliaNew ZealandChinaSingaporeOman
These are countries I have been to where it is less expected. I think most Asian coutires do not tip as do allot of Middle Eastern countries.
quote:Originally posted by Sutho:If the Romans jumped off a cliff I guess you would be doing the same!
Good to see that you are as pleasant and endearing as ever Sutho!
Only in a perfect world. European Lines sailing out of the US have to bow down and serve Iced Tea because it is demanded. RCI cater to the Spanish when sailing ex Barcelona. Costa made changes sailing from China. When in Rome.. only some of the time.
If RCI which to sail ex UK with mainly UK citizens aboard then some things will need to be changed, as they have been in the past. Including tipping in the fare would be of benefit to them. I don't see a problem. Carnival did just that when sailing out of Dover.
I don't mind the tips/service charges however they are made. However when one is paying for a drink, that ends up costing a fair amount more than it is priced on the bar menu [which is often more than in a land based hotel], it is more than an irritation, especially if one has gone to the bar to get it oneself. North Americans are used to this in everyday shopping with sales tax etc - in Europe the price we see is the price we pay however it is split.
Bar menus inc additional charges, fares inc service charges and tips would all be preferable in a European Market. Pay a wage to the crew instead of relying on 'tips' which are compulsory anyway on some lines - Costa. Luxury lines in NA & the UK seem to be able to include them, as they do the excursions & drinks as well.
Cunard, Celebrity, probably more, give an option to pay the service charges in advance when booking. I have done this, but the steward then still hangs around and leaves an envelope asking for more which is an affront imho. If I want to give more I will, but won't if asked for it, especially when he can't be bothered to vacuum metal shavings off the carpets and serves mouldy fruit.
Ultimate Bulletin BoardTM 6.1.0.3
More Vacation & Cruise Specials...