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»	Cruise Talk » Ocean Liners and Classic Cruise Ships » Queen Elizabeth

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Topic: Queen Elizabeth

Barryboat
First Class Passenger
Member # 33

posted 11-05-2002 03:24 PM

I recall in recent months we had a discussion here regarding the fact that the Queen Elizabeth was not as popular as the Queen Mary. I read something last night, in one of my many ocean liner books, that one theory is because the Elizabeth had an eclectic interior..part art deco of the 30's and part decor of the 40's. No one really knew what the original decor was intended to be like because CUNARD kept it a secret. This secretive holding back of the originally intended decor and the fact that the interiors seemed to be sort of a mish-mash of 30's vs 40's decor. The ship suffered a lack of identity.

The Queen Mary, on the other hand had a life before the War and then she was renewed after the War...so people had an opportunity to get to know and love the ship, before and after the War. She also maintained most of her original charming decor.

Posts: 1851 | From: Bloomington, Minnesota (Home to the Mall of America) | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 11-05-2002 04:20 PM

Interesting post Barry. I've go no idea why Elizabeth was not as popular as Queen Mary, apart from the fact that she was built second - this may be reason enough?

I understand that Mary's Art Deco interiors were considered rather too modern by some people at first, particularly by the Monarch.

Interestingly the QM2 will be the first Cunarder to be built with totally retro decor.

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

Green
First Class Passenger
Member # 171

posted 11-05-2002 05:39 PM

Does anyone have Deck Plans of the (original) Queen Mary? They would be interesting to see.

I wonder if her cabins/staterooms were as varied (shape-wise) as those of the QE2.

Did she also have the 'dining desigantion ' by stateroom category or was she strictly First, Tourist or Steerage Class?

I'm told that I was held aloft by my father when she left the Clyde - no memories of the event!

Posts: 2913 | From: Markham, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 99 | IP: Logged

nzmike
First Class Passenger
Member # 1308

posted 11-05-2002 06:40 PM

There are a number of books that have good quality deck plans of the Mary, including Ron Winters books plus the Shipbuilder reprints.

Queen Mary had three dining rooms for First, Second and Third class with total segregation between the three. There was also the Verandah Grille, which was an exclusive First Class only extra-cost restaurant. If you visit the ship today, the First Class Restaurant (now called the Grand Salon) and the Verandah Grille can both be seen. The second and third class retaurants still exist but are used for crew and storage respectively.

Posts: 186 | From: Auckland, New Zealand | Registered: May 2000 | IP: Logged

Green
First Class Passenger
Member # 171

posted 11-06-2002 06:38 PM

quote:
Originally posted by nzmike:
There are a number of books that have good quality deck plans of the Mary, including Ron Winters books plus the Shipbuilder reprints.
Queen Mary had three dining rooms for First, Second and Third class with total segregation between the three. There was also the Verandah Grille, which was an exclusive First Class only extra-cost restaurant. If you visit the ship today, the First Class Restaurant (now called the Grand Salon) and the Verandah Grille can both be seen. The second and third class retaurants still exist but are used for crew and storage respectively.

Interesting to note that 'way back when' there was the Verandah Grille, which was an exclusive First Class only extra-cost restaurant.. and we thought that only now were additional charges being imposed!!

Posts: 2913 | From: Markham, Ontario, Canada | Registered: Jul 99 | IP: Logged

PeterUK
First Class Passenger
Member # 1898

posted 11-06-2002 06:49 PM

From some book I read on the subject some time ago it was said that the QM benefited from making her maiden voyage after the depression and was thus a happy ship whilst the QE made her commercial voyage following the war. Another reason given is that after the war the QE was the commodore's ship and life on board was as a result more staid than on the QM. If royalty travelled on the QM then Cunard had the commodore in command for the voyage.
There was also some special feel on board the QM which the QE didn't seem to capture.

Posts: 217 | From: North of England | Registered: Apr 2001 | IP: Logged

miami cruiser
First Class Passenger
Member # 3117

posted 11-06-2002 08:23 PM

It's just my opinion but I think that the Mary was much more newsworthy both in the US and abroad than the Elizabeth due to her record-breaking size, her symbol as Britain's road to recovery from the Great Depression, and her somewhat nationalistic competition with the Normandie. I think these things made her well known to the public and gave her a celebrity status and therfore she became the more popular of the two.
I have noticed that there are many photos of the construction of the Queen Mary in books, but few of the Elizabeth. I have always thought that perhaps there was not as much interest in the Elizabeth from the beginning as there was for the Mary and this perhaps continued after the war when she finally entered passenger service. This is just my guess anyway. Perhaps the Mary just had a kinder soul.

Posts: 158 | From: Miami | Registered: Jun 2002 | IP: Logged

Barryboat
First Class Passenger
Member # 33

posted 11-06-2002 09:20 PM

miami cruiser,

FYI, The Queen Mary would have been the first 1000 foot liner but because of the depression, her construction was halted. While Hull # 534 was rusting away the Normandie was finished..and became the first 1000 foot liner in active service...and the Normandie was larger than Queen Mary. Queen Elizabeth was the record breaker when it came to size, Queen Mary was the speed record breaker...she finally captured the Blue Ribbon from the Normandie and kept it till the Big U took it away in 1952.

Posts: 1851 | From: Bloomington, Minnesota (Home to the Mall of America) | Registered: Mar 99 | IP: Logged

joe at travelpage
Administrator
Member # 622

posted 11-07-2002 08:41 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Green:
Does anyone have Deck Plans of the (original) Queen Mary? They would be interesting to see.
I wonder if her cabins/staterooms were as varied (shape-wise) as those of the QE2.
Did she also have the 'dining desigantion ' by stateroom category or was she strictly First, Tourist or Steerage Class?

Green,

I have deck charts of both Queen Mary and Queen Elizabeth. They definitely had different dining designations depending on whether you booked First Class or Tourist Class. There's even a difference between the deck charts - First Class with nice color photos while Tourist is black and white.

First Class Accommodations:

Larger Version

Fairly consistent shapes although many of the First Class cabins were designed to be connected to others as suites or the smaller inside cabins were booked for servants.

Tourist Class Accommodations:

Larger Version

Sizes and shapes are all over the place and many have their "facilities" down the hall.

Joe at TravelPage.com

Posts: 29976 | From: Great Falls, Virginia | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

vikingcrown
First Class Passenger
Member # 3437

posted 11-07-2002 11:37 PM

Another reason why Queen Mary is so much more famous than the Queen Elizabeth is one reason: the Queen Mary exist today in Long Beach, CA. It is true that the Queen Elizabeth was a better ship. It was more modern, had the latest facilities, and had only two smokestacks, as well as other post-war dash.

Posts: 341 | From: California | Registered: Oct 2002 | IP: Logged

empressport
First Class Passenger
Member # 2511

posted 11-09-2002 02:02 PM

I thought I read somewhere that when comparing the two Queens on a yearly basis, the Elizabeth actually carried more passengers. Can anyone back this up? Given that she had 12 boilers to the Mary's 24, I would imagine she must have been more efficient, and therefore more profitable.

Posts: 464 | From: Vancouver, BC | Registered: Oct 2001 | IP: Logged

vikingcrown
First Class Passenger
Member # 3437

posted 11-10-2002 09:59 PM

Is there anyone with Queen Elizabeth deck plans online? I have the Queen Mary's, and I'd like to compare them.

Posts: 341 | From: California | Registered: Oct 2002 | IP: Logged

desirod7
First Class Passenger
Member # 1626

posted 08-06-2010 11:25 AM

[ 08-06-2010: Message edited by: desirod7 ]

Posts: 5727 | From: Philadelphia, Pa [home of the SS United States] | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged

Maasdam
First Class Passenger
Member # 3858

posted 08-06-2010 06:44 PM

quote:
Originally posted by Green:
Interesting to note that 'way back when' there was the Verandah Grille, which was an exclusive First Class only extra-cost restaurant.. and we thought that only now were additional charges being imposed!!

I don't know if she was the first but Olympic have a extra cost restaurant back in 1911. And maybe not so well know that some lines before 1900, third class passengers have to pay extra fore food during the trip. So officially they where the first to have a cost plus restaurant a/b

I always understand that Crew liked the QE above QM, because there facility's where much better.

Question, I never have seen good interior images from Queen Elizabeth which is my favorite of the two. Have someone a link to a good site. Tank you......

Greetings Ben.

Posts: 4695 | From: Rotterdam home of the tss. Rotterdam. | Registered: May 2003 | IP: Logged

lasuvidaboy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4527

posted 08-06-2010 08:53 PM

I've seen many images (color and B&W) of QE and QM and I prefer the interiors of QM as built.

QM's interiors were slightly more ornate while her newer fleetmate's interiors were designed in simpler moderne style. Both ships of course had gorgeous woodwork.

Posts: 7654 | From: Hollywood Hills/L.A. | Registered: Mar 2004 | IP: Logged

NAL
First Class Passenger
Member # 1102

posted 08-06-2010 09:54 PM

As I have said many times, QE's exterior was far superior to QM.....IMHO. She is one of my all time favorites.

Posts: 2243 | From: Watsontown, PA | Registered: Feb 2000 | IP: Logged

lasuvidaboy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4527

posted 08-06-2010 10:13 PM

quote:
Originally posted by NAL:
As I have said many times, QE's exterior was far superior to QM.....IMHO. She is one of my all time favorites.

I agree. QE was one of the best-looking liners ever built and few other ships ever came close to matching her near perfect profile.

Posts: 7654 | From: Hollywood Hills/L.A. | Registered: Mar 2004 | IP: Logged

etruriaguy
First Class Passenger
Member # 16603

posted 08-07-2010 12:51 AM

Empressport. Your quite right. In Clive harveys amazing book RMS Queen Elizabeth The Ultimate Ship, it has a chart clearly showing the QE's annual average passenger count per voyage was higher than QM's every year from 1956 up until their retirement. So I guess the Mary was really just the more openly celebrated of the 2 ships. The books the best one I've seen on the QE with wonderful color pictures of many interiors from 1st to 3rd class. Love it,well worth getting.

Posts: 36 | From: san francisco | Registered: Jul 2008 | IP: Logged

Cunard Fan
First Class Passenger
Member # 7530

posted 08-07-2010 06:37 AM

quote:
Originally posted by Maasdam:

I always understand that Crew liked the QE above QM, because there facility's where much better.

Funny, I have always heard and read the oposite that crews prefered the Queen Mary because she was warm, cozy and had endearing qualities that the QE aparently didn't have like QM. I also remember reading the the QM was a easier ship to work.

Posts: 2327 | From: Pasadena just north of Queen Mary | Registered: Sep 2006 | IP: Logged

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