Cruise Talk: Bremen of 1929 model

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»	Cruise Talk » Ocean Liners and Classic Cruise Ships » Bremen of 1929 model

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Topic: Bremen of 1929 model

linerlvr
First Class Passenger
Member # 2009

posted 03-04-2004 05:24 PM

In September 2001 I wrote concerning a model of the 1929 Bremen which I saw in New London, CT about 1963.

I have since located a photo of that model and will attempt to attach it to this post. Does anyone remember this or know anything about the model?? As I recall, the forward stack was hinged so that someone could sit inside (note the large window on the front of the superstructure).

If someone could give me some information on this, it would be very much appreciated!!

[ 03-04-2004: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

Posts: 18 | From: Long Beach, CA | Registered: May 2001 | IP: Logged

Onno
First Class Passenger
Member # 3071

posted 03-04-2004 06:30 PM

I have seen more pictures of the model speeding along in New York harbour, It also sailed past the Statendam IV. The model was build by some German sailors and it took them 10 years to complete the 39 feet long model. It came across the Atlantic with the Big U (if I’m not mistaking) and was supposed to sail land inwards to Washington. The boot was operated via a hatch behind funnel number two.

Best, Onno

Posts: 3583 | From: the Netherlands (Berenbotje ging uit varen...) | Registered: May 2002 | IP: Logged

joe at travelpage
Administrator
Member # 622

posted 03-04-2004 06:30 PM

You think that's a big model? Check out this one I found of the Bremen at the Speyer Museum:

Joe at TravelPage.com

Posts: 29976 | From: Great Falls, Virginia | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-04-2004 06:37 PM

Joe, this is a QM2 of models!
I saw in Shipbuilder a huge pre-war model of Bremen in Germany.
Not sure if it survived, but what about this working model imported by ssUS?
BTW, anybody seen a similar version of the Queens in Thorpe Park, Middlesex, 70-80's?
ssLewis, most intrigued!

[ 03-09-2004: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

linerlvr
First Class Passenger
Member # 2009

posted 03-04-2004 10:47 PM

Is it possible that the color photo and the black and white are the same one?? Looking at the color photo, it looks like there is a large window on the front of the superstructure, just like in the b&w photo; also, to see the scale of the model, there is a person standing on the dock near the aft end of the model.

I would be interested in seeing other photos of this, especially of it in New York harbor.

Thanks for the help!

Posts: 18 | From: Long Beach, CA | Registered: May 2001 | IP: Logged

joe at travelpage
Administrator
Member # 622

posted 03-04-2004 10:59 PM

quote:
Originally posted by linerlvr:
Is it possible that the color photo and the black and white are the same one??

I wondered that too after I posted the picture. But if that's a cabin cruiser tied up behind the Bremen in the black and white photo, the scale is wrong.

On the other hand, the photo on the easel in front of the model in the color photo is supposed to be the model in action on the water.

More info is welcomed.

Joe at TravelPage.com

Posts: 29976 | From: Great Falls, Virginia | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

Michael534
First Class Passenger
Member # 2953

posted 03-04-2004 11:58 PM

I don't know, Joe. At first I too thought the scale was wrong, but after looking closely, I think it may be right. That cabin cruiser is probably at least 35 ft long. And if you imagine lifting the model out of the water and comparing how high the man on the pier would be to it compared to the people in the second photo, it looks like it would be about the same.

I wonder what the inside of the model looked like. It was more than likely just enginde and room for a couple of persons. I hope someone has some more info in this. I had never heard of this model before.

Michael534

Posts: 483 | From: Washington DC | Registered: Apr 2002 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 03-05-2004 04:35 AM

This museum looks amazing! You can download a .pdf for a quiz to complete when going round.
One of the questions is:-

Exhibit - Bremen IV
Info: The Bremen IV is the biggest ship model in the world.
Question: What is the scale of the model?
1:80
1:25
2:10

Unfortunately I cannot find the answers
Pam

[ 03-05-2004: Message edited by: PamM ]

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

linerguy
First Class Passenger
Member # 4289

posted 03-05-2004 09:22 AM

Pretty sure it's the same model. The window on the forward superstructure is clearly visable in this photo:

Larger Version

Notice the white "handle bars" bolted to each side of the model...my guess is that's how they moved the thing around. They don't appear to be on the B&W photo....

Very cool!

Russ

[ 03-05-2004: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

Posts: 1486 | From: Bright, Indiana | Registered: Dec 2003 | IP: Logged

Onno
First Class Passenger
Member # 3071

posted 03-05-2004 11:03 AM

I did some searching and found the cool picture I was talking about earlier. The Bremen model passing the Statendam. Pretty funny actually a trick of scale. You can see the head of the man steering the model behind funnel number two. I guess it could be same model as in the museum, the size of the flags seem to be corresponding, but then again the museum model looks much bigger?! Must be because the underwater part is showing.

Best, Onno

Larger Version

[ 03-05-2004: Message edited by: joe at travelpage ]

Posts: 3583 | From: the Netherlands (Berenbotje ging uit varen...) | Registered: May 2002 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 03-05-2004 11:25 AM

Wonderful Onno... I can't believe 2 of these models would have been built, but I am still not convinced they are one & the same. The plate on the bow is not there in the museum. If you put that lady inside, it seems she would be somewhat less significant that the chap in your picture? I don't know

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

linerlvr
First Class Passenger
Member # 2009

posted 03-05-2004 09:57 PM

Thanks, Onno for finding and posting the picture in New York Harbor. It's amazing to actually see it "underway".

Also, thanks to Michael and Joe for sharing their color photos. The more I look at them and compare with the black and whites, the more convinced I am that they are one in the same.

Posts: 18 | From: Long Beach, CA | Registered: May 2001 | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-09-2004 10:50 AM

Where is the model?
Anybody been inside?
ssLewis, impressed

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

Malcolm @ cruisepage
Cruise Director
Member # 301

posted 03-09-2004 03:10 PM

You can't fool me Joe, that museum model is not big at all! You have simply built scale models of some people and positioned them next to it!

Those clever German's at www.classic-ship.de offer a slightly smaller model for sale:

[ 03-09-2004: Message edited by: Malcolm @ cruisepage ]

Posts: 19210 | From: Essex (Just Outside London) | Registered: A Long Time Ago! | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-11-2004 01:49 PM

If i get as lucky as Love to see the model in Onno's picture sailing in Cherbourg!
I saw a similar model in a preWWII Shipbuilder.
BTW, has anybody seen huge models of the Queens at Thorpe Park, Middlesex, in the 70's?
ssLewis, loving these huge models!

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 03-11-2004 06:21 PM

quote:
Originally posted by sslewis:
BTW, has anybody seen huge models of the Queens at Thorpe Park, Middlesex, in the 70's?
ssLewis, loving these huge models!

The Bremen Model is in the Speyer Museum.
The last time I visited Thorpe Park was in 1995? or thereabouts. I don't recall any models of the Queens, but I'd have taken a photo if I did see them. You mean in the "Model World" bit in the gardens, well i think it was just a Model World before it became a theme park proper? I last went before Tussauds took over and just recall the Eiffel Tower and similar things. I am not sure if the model section even still exists? I will look out the photos tomorrow.
I wonder if there is a Queen at Legoland, Windsor? Again I can't recall and I haven't been there for 3 years. Do remember Eurostar & the Dome though

Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-17-2004 12:05 PM

Thanks Pam for your testimony.
In march 1991, whilst cycling by Runnymede farm near Staines, I found what was a mould for a 6 meters model of rmsQueen Elizabeth!
I was intrigued by very detailed promenade windows and portholes inside the hull!
The farmer told me how models had been buolt from the mould, but sold after an accident in Thorpe Park.
I actually worked there, but the records only went to 1985..TP opened in 1976 by Lord Mountbatten.
Nearly fainted, and the farmer offered me to take it away!
Mould was on the other side of the M25.
Someone must have pictures of the models?
ssLewis, who nearly bought a van!

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

PamM
First Class Passenger
Member # 2127

posted 03-17-2004 01:23 PM

Having a quick look for a picture I came across the Denny Ship Model Experiment Tank in Dumbarton. Has anyone been?
Pam

Posts: 12176 | From: Cambridge, UK | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged

Onno
First Class Passenger
Member # 3071

posted 03-18-2004 11:52 AM

I found some additional information about the model,

First I thought the model was carried over the Atlantic by the Big U but I now know it was by North German Lloyd freighter the Neckarstein. The size of the ship is 10 tons and sailed up the Hudson River on July 25th 1962. Like the big liners a NY harbour pilot had to take control of the model.

The model was given the nickname Bremen IV Junior.

Best, Onno

Posts: 3583 | From: the Netherlands (Berenbotje ging uit varen...) | Registered: May 2002 | IP: Logged

sslewis
First Class Passenger
Member # 3649

posted 03-22-2004 08:10 AM

Thanks Pam for the Irvine Museum link.
Went there after my Waverley cruise, and only saw a Q3 model that Onno will find in the link???
As for your Bremen IV Junior, I wonder when it was built?
I swear I saw a similar model preWWII in Germany, with a man inside, but not like your spectacular Statendam shot!
Wish we all it were Liberte? Or the then Bremen?
As for my huge Queens at Thorpe Park, I remember Runnymede farm man telling me they were used in the old test tank, now demolished and rebuilt at Twikenham.
Surely Eastleigh Steam trains operators near Southampton could have a liner in their lake????
Imagine a QM2 model passing the real thing in the Solent???

Posts: 2513 | From: Shipspotting Solent shores when weather allows.... | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged

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